1joeranger Posted February 1, 2009 Share #1 Posted February 1, 2009 Riding back from a camping trip this weekend (We can do that in Florida during January!) when I noticed my trailer was fishtailing back n forth. I stopped checked tires, good, rearranged camping gear and took off again. Got back up to cruising speed of about 70 and noticed a slight wobble, within a few minutes I've got the trailer fishtailing again. Slowed to below 65 and the fishtailing is gone! Continued home keeping below that speed with no further issue. I have had this trailer for awhile first behind my 1100 Shadow and now behind my RSTD. Until now I always forgot the trailer was back there. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunboat Posted February 1, 2009 Share #2 Posted February 1, 2009 hi ray i pulled my tralier to the 08 international rally in kitchener,ontario. my trailer was fulley loaded with stuff straped to the top. the only time the trailer would wiggle is when a 18-wheeler would pass me or i pass them. and only by the rear tandam axels ( i guess the wind buffeing) but not the rest of the truck. how about the tire pressures on the trailer i think it put the max air pressure in my trailer tires. i don't think i helped you much maybe someone else will chime in with more experiance. best reguards don c. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted February 1, 2009 Share #3 Posted February 1, 2009 First off check your tire pressures, I see you done that, but too high or too low for the weight carried can also be an issue. It then comes down to loading and having some weight in the trailer, no weight is not a good thing, so maybe you need to add some weight. Normally speaking you like to have 20 lb on the hitch, but if that leaves the rest of the trailer empty, so to speak, it will fish tail, so then you add some roadside gravel to help out if necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friesman Posted February 1, 2009 Share #4 Posted February 1, 2009 Ive never pulled a trailer behind my bike, but behind a cage you need a minimum of 10% of total trailer weight on hitch. But on a bike I would imagine you have to be mindful of maximum as well as minimum weights on hitch. Maybe something shifted during the trip causing to much or too little weight on the hitch? Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOO Posted February 1, 2009 Share #5 Posted February 1, 2009 Not enough tongue weight is my guess, happens with all two wheel trailers if not loaded properly, even my skid loader trailer does it if I don't have it loaded right. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckShot Posted February 1, 2009 Share #6 Posted February 1, 2009 Riding back from a camping trip this weekend (We can do that in Florida during January!) when I noticed my trailer was fishtailing back n forth. I stopped checked tires, good, rearranged camping gear and took off again. Got back up to cruising speed of about 70 and noticed a slight wobble, within a few minutes I've got the trailer fishtailing again. Slowed to below 65 and the fishtailing is gone! Continued home keeping below that speed with no further issue. I have had this trailer for awhile first behind my 1100 Shadow and now behind my RSTD. Until now I always forgot the trailer was back there. Any thoughts? Sounds like you have some experiance with bikes and trailers---Tire pressure --load should have been good with your experiance-- I would check all nuts and bolts on springs-frame-tounge,etc. --Also hitch and ball--other than that my guess would have been load shifting. One other thought, how long have you pulled it behind the RSTD? Would the trailer behind a different bike make any difference-Tounge not level or long enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEER30 Posted February 1, 2009 Share #7 Posted February 1, 2009 Tongue weight is the issue . Happens to me all the time , but I don't even notice it until the cages start to back off . I guess it scares the crap out of them being behind me seeing the BEERCART weaving and bouncing . Redistribute your weight in the trailer . I made some lead weights to carry along if I need them when running a lite load and I move the forward or aft to desired position . I also have a built in cooler up front , that I add more beer and Ice to get more weight if needed . I've played with the air pressure , but got no resolve . So I say it's the weight distribution . BEER30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary N. Posted February 1, 2009 Share #8 Posted February 1, 2009 Definitely too much loaded weight on the back side of the axle. Like others say not enough tongue weight. This is the voice of experience. Pulling a trailer with too much weight on the back end will cause a very dangerous fishtail problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradT Posted February 2, 2009 Share #9 Posted February 2, 2009 Yup I just add a big cooler loaded with ice and drinks on the tongue. Solves the problem everytime Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1joeranger Posted February 2, 2009 Author Share #10 Posted February 2, 2009 Thanks everyone! Nice to have such a wealth of experience pour in! Hate guessing about cause and effect. I believe I will go figure out my tongue weight and my trailer weight and then add ice to the cooler till I have the correct ratio. Once again, THANKS!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazmocycle Posted February 2, 2009 Share #11 Posted February 2, 2009 too much weight behind axle. i almost got killed by this very thing. was hauling a load of lumber behind my van and it started to sway back and forth, slowed down and went away. got back up to speed and it started again, then a 18 wheeler pass going the other way, and the trailer went wild, was going from side to side of 2-lane road, and another 18 wheeler was heading toward us. fought it back into my side of road and got it stopped on side of road. moved weight to front and solved problem. this has happened to me with my motorcycle, and i adjust weight toward front and it stops. you can set the tongue of trailer on a set of bath scales and load the trailer till it reads about 30-40#s. pick upthe tongue and get a feel of what it weighs and try to load it the same, i would load it heavy to the front than go the other way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddlebum Posted February 2, 2009 Share #12 Posted February 2, 2009 Tongue wieght is a common cause but so is weight distribution load heavy items down low and light bulky items on top.A trailer that is too top heavy is as dangerous as one that does not have enough tongue weight. Yup I just add a big cooler loaded with ice and drinks on the tongue. Solves the problem everytime Brad PS I prefer to substitute extra drinks in place of the ice:thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Butler Posted February 2, 2009 Share #13 Posted February 2, 2009 Ray, I don't think you said what kind of trailer you had, or if it was a home built. One of the main causes of this type of tail-wagging-the-dog is that the tongue is too short. If it is a home built maybe you should lengthen the tongue? An general rule of thumb for tongue length is that the distance from the hitch to the axle is close to twice the width of the wheelbase. In otherwords, a short tongue is not a good thing. Then like some have already pointed out, you need most of the weight over the wheels and forward. Put all of your light stuff behind the wheels and more tongue weight is better than too little. I usually try to get around 25-30 lbs of tongue weight which you can check with a set of bathroom scales sitting on something the same height of your hitch. Once you pack a trailer a few times, you will learn what bags go where and you won't need to check the weight every time. What most people don't realize is that once you start moving, the tongue weight starts to decrease and get lighter the faster you move. And NEVER pull an empty trailer, where you need some weight in it in front of the wheels. Hope this helps, Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bryan52577 Posted February 2, 2009 Share #14 Posted February 2, 2009 I have pulled a trailer with many different types of bikes. Yes, to what everyone keeps saying about trailer tongue weight. Now with that said you have pulled your trailer before with out issue you stated, so you already know that? What I want to know is what road you were on? Was it a "Black top" some times they get groves from trucks that if you ride where you always do, then the trailer will want fishtail some. It depends on your wheel width, some roads you have NO problems some you do. And the roads do change from season to season with truck traffic as it is. Have you ever pulled the trailer on that road before with no problems? If you get a chance pull the trailer on another road and / or in a "different" place / grove on your side of the road and see if it is still there? What I have found in my years of trailer pulling is if I load it the same all the time and have an issue I can usually change driving habits on that road and take care of the issue. Another factor is how much cross wind did you have? One problem with real lite trailers is wind is your enemy. Good luck in finding your problem. Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1joeranger Posted February 2, 2009 Author Share #15 Posted February 2, 2009 Rick, I think you are right about my tongue being to short. I bought the trailer used and really do not know its pedigree. Thanks for the bath scale solution I was scratching my rear thinking how to accomplish this. I'll send a picture as soon as I doll her up with a new tongue and paint job which is my winter project! (or what we call winter here in Florida) Bryan, the road, Florida 285, is a two lane blacktop that cuts through Eglin AFB test range from Niceville to I10. Traffic is usually light and the road is fairly straight with no stopsigns from end to end, about 16 miles. Posted speed is 60mph. I travel this road once or twice a week visiting my girlfriend and have pulled my trailer numerous time along it. No grooves really to talk about. The wind was, I think, a factor but in this case a small contributing one. I have two container packed in my trailer. The containers are plastic bins you can buy at Wallmart to store stuff in. One contains the "Kitchen" the other the "Bedroom". Besides those two I have a Coleman "Tucana" tent which sits bewteen the two containers. The "Bedroom" container is the heavier and it was sitting behind the wheels. The Cooler which sits on the tongue was empty. Since everyone has shown so much interest and shared their experiences I will weight everything, take pictures, and post the results. I have learned a ton from all of you, THANKS!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted February 2, 2009 Share #16 Posted February 2, 2009 Another thing beside tongue weight is axle alignment. It may be tracking off to one side and when you hit 70+ the wind stream is starting to effect it. Flip it upside down and measure the distance from each side of the axle to a midpoint on the coupler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted February 2, 2009 Share #17 Posted February 2, 2009 What does the owner's manual that came with the trailer say about loading? There should be some info on the trailer about loading and tire pressures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catang5oh Posted February 2, 2009 Share #18 Posted February 2, 2009 check them wheel bearings also, could have one wearing and it will let that wheel wobble just a little, and on a trailer that small, i would think it would magnify the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddlebum Posted February 2, 2009 Share #19 Posted February 2, 2009 Another thing beside tongue weight is axle alignment. It may be tracking off to one side and when you hit 70+ the wind stream is starting to effect it. Flip it upside down and measure the distance from each side of the axle to a midpoint on the coupler. check them wheel bearings also, could have one wearing and it will let that wheel wobble just a little, and on a trailer that small, i would think it would magnify the problem. these are all good suggestions in the case of the first one I agree but I prefer to go a step further. Remove the wheel hubs and bearings from the axle and measure from the end of each axle end to make sure it is centered to the body. Then measure from the center of each spindle end to the center of the hitch, the measurement should be the same on each side,the reason I prefer to do this with the hobs off is because it is more accurate then by checking with the wheels and hub on and it is a good time to check and repack your bearings while you have it apart. also check all fastners and u-bolts to make sure they are secure, and your axle is not moving around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ardrey Posted February 2, 2009 Share #20 Posted February 2, 2009 I found that when I added the leveling links that raised the tongue of my trailor that I had to increase the tongue weight to stop the trailor wag. Have you done anything to change your suspension that would account for the wag besides afore mentioned suggestions? A significant increase in rear shock pressure or riding one up as opposed to two up could theoretically change the tongue angle enough to get a similar response as me adding the leveling links. Just an added thought. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRider Posted February 2, 2009 Share #21 Posted February 2, 2009 When I first got my trailer, I took it out with a couple of 40 lb bags of rock salt to see how it felt. It made a difference how the bags were placed in the trailer. You may want to do some testing with salt or sand bags. They are easy to move around and they stay in place. Also, when you are pulling your trailer - check your rear tire pressure and wear. The extra weight of the trailer will make a difference in the life - don't ask me why I know this - it was almost a major face plant in the wilds of WV. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1joeranger Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share #22 Posted February 3, 2009 OK, here is the gameplan! Weigh Trailer Weigh containers in front of wheels Weigh containers behind wheels [*]Weigh Tongue Weight [*]Install longer tongue 38" wheel to wheel 52" axle to tongue Aggie math says I need another 24" [*]Confirm tongue center line [*]Repack bearings [*]Take pictures [*]Post results Thank you to everyone's input! I have learned alot and appreciate the effort involved. Someone reading all this, including myself, should save themselves from serious harm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckShot Posted February 3, 2009 Share #23 Posted February 3, 2009 I seen this posted some time ago and saved it. Just in case anyone is interested. Its for a book called PULLING YOUR TAIL. www.customcruiserchrome.com/book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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