Freebird Posted July 27, 2007 Author Share #51 Posted July 27, 2007 Done already. I was up at 6:30 this morning and got right on it. Took me about an hour to do the swap and that included pulling the saddlebags, mufflers, rear wheel, pulling the rear end, greasing the drive shaft, etc. All that I need to do now is put the rear wheel, mufflers, bags back on but I can't do that until the local shop opens here and I get the new tire put on. Also going to put on some new rear brake pads while I have it down. Should be able to get it out for a test ride this afternoon and report the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibvel Posted July 27, 2007 Share #52 Posted July 27, 2007 Done already. I was up at 6:30 this morning and got right on it. Took me about an hour to do the swap and that included pulling the saddlebags, mufflers, rear wheel, pulling the rear end, greasing the drive shaft, etc. All that I need to do now is put the rear wheel, mufflers, bags back on but I can't do that until the local shop opens here and I get the new tire put on. Also going to put on some new rear brake pads while I have it down. Should be able to get it out for a test ride this afternoon and report the results. Don, you da man!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted July 28, 2007 Author Share #53 Posted July 28, 2007 OK....here is my initial report on the VMAX rear end. It has rained here off and on all day today so I didn't get to ride as much as I wanted to but did manage to get about 30 miles in just to do some preliminary tests. First of all I will say that in my opinion, this is the gearing that Yamaha should have put in these bikes. I know that the RSV was built as more of a cruiser but I think they went too far with the high gearing, especially in 5th gear. I realize that these are not sport bikes but they are not high torque VTwins either. These V4s like to rev and the need to get up some RPMs before they really find their power bands. It's almost like Yamaha tried to get that high torque, low RPM loping out of these bikes and these engines just aren't made for that. With the original rear end, I was running 4,000 RPM in 4th gear and about 3100 or so in 5th gear both of these at 70 MPH. With the VMAX rear, the RPMs are running almost exactly 500 higher at the same speed. About 4500 RPM in 4th at 70 MPH and about 3600 RPM in 5th at 70 MPH. Of course 1-3 run higher at any given speed also so you will be shifting out of the lower gears a bit quicker. I find the performance to be significantly increased with the VMAX rear. From strictly a seat of the pants feeling, it really jumps when you take off and hammer it through the gears. In more casual riding, it feels much better now when you roll on the throttle in 5th gear. Before the swap, anything below 60 MPH you just pretty much had to downshift to 4th if you wanted to accelerate. With the VMAX rear, it's not a rocket but you have decent acceleration when you roll on from 60 MPH and it's not even bad from 50 MPH. While the 4000 RPM in 4th at 70 MPH was equivalent to the first gen in 5th gear, it still seemed just a bit much .... probably because we are so used to the engine loping along at 3000 or so RPM in 5th. The 3600 RPM in 5th with the new rear end feels really good though. Doesn't feel like it is wrapped too tight and yet you still have good acceleration when you roll on the throttle. This is an easy modification. If you have a lift, you can do it. If you have ever pulled your rear end to grease the drive shaft, splines, etc., you have done it already. Same thing except you put this rear end back instead of the one that you remove. So...that's about all I can tell you for now. At this point, I am VERY happy with the results and wish I had done this 8 years ago. I am anxious to put some freeway or good state route miles on it to see what the gas mileage does but to be honest, based upon my earlier tests running in 4th gear, I really expect this to have no negative affect on mileage and even halfway expect to see an increase. I am also anxious to try it with my loaded trailer behind me. I KNOW this is going to be MUCH better in that case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOO Posted July 28, 2007 Share #54 Posted July 28, 2007 Don, Very interesting, I'm probably not going to do the conversion but what you have said is about what I expected also. It's interesting that the 1st gen runs so high of an RPM for a given speed but it really doesn't seem like it when you are riding. I have a feeling the sound of the exhaust has a lot to do with that. As you know I run the HD pipes and after you had posted you were going to do this I did some highway riding in 4th gear and I got to tell you I thought the bike was going to blow up. Again a lot of it is the pipes. As far as the gas mileage, I bet you don't lose much riding 1 up and I would think the mileage might even be better 2 up and pulling the trailer. The added torque should help a bunch 2 up and pulling the trailer. I had a pickup several years ago with a manual overdrive and I drove it 400 miles one direction in overdrive and then drove it back in 4th gear, no difference in gas mileage. Keep us posted. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyDawg Posted July 28, 2007 Share #55 Posted July 28, 2007 I don't know. I would think the gas mileage would go down. If you are turning an average of 500 more RPM I would think it would use more gas to run there. Just my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flb_78 Posted July 28, 2007 Share #56 Posted July 28, 2007 I don't know. I would think the gas mileage would go down. If you are turning an average of 500 more RPM I would think it would use more gas to run there. Just my thoughts. not necessarily, hypothetically, if youre running in 5th at 3100 rpm at 70 mph, you're throttle position would be 50%, but now with the higher rpm's, you're utilizing more of the horsepower curve and only using 30% throttle.... now that I read that, it doesn't make sense, but in my head I know what I meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted July 28, 2007 Author Share #57 Posted July 28, 2007 That is exactly right....not sure about the percentages but the idea is correct. Coming back from Fort Collins, there were numerous times when I was trying to run in 5th gear but bucking a strong headwind along with pulling a fairly heavy trailer, I would sometimes find that my throttle was wide open when pulling decent inclines and etc. At other times, even not pulling a trailer or bucking headwinds, it seems that you are really lugging the engine and then when you try to accelerate, you are again pretty much at full throttle and acceleration is just very slow. In those cases, you are really better off downshifting into 4th gear but often we don't. The 500 RPM just seems to put you in a much better range of the power band. I will confirm the fuel mileage when I can and I may be wrong but based on my test where I ran through a full tank of gas in 4th gear at 4,000 RPM and got the same fuel mileage as Bob Dakin running normally, mostly in 5th, I can't see that the mileage is going to suffer. That test WAS done riding two up and pulling a trailer though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squidley Posted July 28, 2007 Share #58 Posted July 28, 2007 I dont think it's going to dent the fuel economy at all, the engine will be in a better RPM for the powerband and it's "sweet spot" I have been wanting to do this for about a year now and I just never got to it. Looks like I'll be sending that spare G2 rearend I bought for it in and have it done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted July 28, 2007 Share #59 Posted July 28, 2007 Thanks for the report Don this really caught my interest. Im wondering how it feels coming out of the hole. Ive had a bunch of bikes in my life and never had a bike so slow out of the hole as the RSV. I would love to have the power to smoke the rear wheel if I wanted . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted July 28, 2007 Author Share #60 Posted July 28, 2007 Eddie, I thought about and should have done some timed runs before and after the swap but due to weather and wanting to get it done, I just didn't get around to it. I can tell you for sure that it is quicker out of the hole and through all the gears. Smoking the tire? I don't know about that. Also, there have been a number of posts about what this will do to the fuel economy. As I've said, I really expect it to have very little affect and I really expect to see an improvement riding two up and pulling the trailer. BUT...if I'm wrong about that...oh well. I am so happy with this change that even if I were to lose 3 or 4 MPG, it will be worth it to me. I understand that fuel economy is important, especially with the price of gas now. Heck...I made the mistake of rolling into Aspen, CO on reserve and paid $4.10 a gallon in Aspen. To me though, the improvement in the performance more than makes up for a couple of MPG of fuel economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneck Posted July 28, 2007 Share #61 Posted July 28, 2007 I wouldn't expect a major difference in fuel mileage under normal riding and a possible improvement with heavy loads. The tall overdrives in newer vehicles is not just an economy issue. I'm sure most have noticed that newer engines last 3 or 4 times more miles than older engines did. There are several reasons for that one is that they run much slower every time the piston passes through the cylinder it causes wear so more passes mean more wear per mile. There is also the greater air flow issue even with the best air filters you get debris into the engine more air at higher rpm more debris and more wear. These engines are so long lived I don't think with good service you will wear one out until the bike has very high mileage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted July 30, 2007 Share #62 Posted July 30, 2007 Don one more thing. Do they come in CHROME ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted July 30, 2007 Author Share #63 Posted July 30, 2007 LOL...should have KNOWN you would ask that. I haven't seen chrome on their site. I did see one a while back on Ebay that had been polished and it looked very much like chrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awsmsrv Posted July 31, 2007 Share #64 Posted July 31, 2007 Don, did you ever find out which 1 you got? The MAX-RS listed under Royal Star or the MAX-Venture listed under Venture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concours Posted July 31, 2007 Share #65 Posted July 31, 2007 LOL, But the wicked tall gears is a BIG part of the reason i chose the RS... sick and tired of tractor gears at cruising speeds.... 80-85 is just the cat's a$$ with these gears... just downshift when riding slower or using it to tow your Airstream.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsstar Posted August 3, 2007 Share #66 Posted August 3, 2007 Ditto on what Concours said, but each to his own. I am anxious to hear Don's test results. I know this isn't a good comparison but I'll mention it anyway. While riding with my son recently I asked what his rpms was at our cruising speed of about 80 indicated. I THINK he said somewhere around 2800rpms. This is on a new HD Streetglide. My rpms was close to 3800. When I'm cruising on the interstate on cruise control I kind of wish my 5th was a little taller. But then even at slower speeds I have a bad habit of being in too high a gear. Learned that on the same ride with son up around Blairsville and Deals Gap. When we did Cherhola Parkway I forced myself to go at least a gear down and found it MUCH easier to do the curves, faster. Am still learning to ride even though I've been riding for over 39 years. Wish I could ride as good as my son. I wish the RSV handled as good as the Streetglide appears to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JGorom Posted August 6, 2007 Share #67 Posted August 6, 2007 Don...just call me Mr. Impatience (and I am sure I am not the only one) but I'm really interested in hearing more about the results of your gear swap out. MPG, sound and handling differences, any regrets...maybe you could give us your second opinion. Later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted August 6, 2007 Share #68 Posted August 6, 2007 Gunna do my swap this winter when I am not riding. Yep! It is just what my bike needs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted August 6, 2007 Author Share #69 Posted August 6, 2007 Don...just call me Mr. Impatience (and I am sure I am not the only one) but I'm really interested in hearing more about the results of your gear swap out. MPG, sound and handling differences, any regrets...maybe you could give us your second opinion. Later... Sorry...don't mean to leave anybody hanging on this or the brake modification but I was in Lexington, KY all last week and now I'm in Rochester, NY. I got home over the weekend but it rained the entire time. The Vogel trip may be the first chance I have for a real test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOO Posted August 7, 2007 Share #70 Posted August 7, 2007 Hey Don, we will be coming right past Rochester, NY. tomorrow, stand on the overpass and wave to us as we go by. We are in Austinburg Ohio tonight. See you at Vogel next week. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted August 7, 2007 Author Share #71 Posted August 7, 2007 I'll be there waving and am really looking forward to Vogel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JGorom Posted August 7, 2007 Share #72 Posted August 7, 2007 Sorry...don't mean to leave anybody hanging on this or the brake modification but I was in Lexington, KY all last week and now I'm in Rochester, NY. Robert (Bongobobby) and myself are close to Rochester, I'm about 30-40 minutes from downtown. Wish I would have know you were coming. How long are you going to be in Rochester? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midrsv Posted August 7, 2007 Share #73 Posted August 7, 2007 Sorry...don't mean to leave anybody hanging on this or the brake modification but I was in Lexington, KY all last week and now I'm in Rochester, NY. I got home over the weekend but it rained the entire time. The Vogel trip may be the first chance I have for a real test. You need to post your schedule. Had I known you were in Lexington last week I would have bought you dinner one night. Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted August 7, 2007 Author Share #74 Posted August 7, 2007 I will try to post from now on where I'll be. I plan to be in Rochester until Thursday morning. I know that next week I'll be in the Dayton, OH area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyHorse Posted August 8, 2007 Share #75 Posted August 8, 2007 LOL, But the wicked tall gears is a BIG part of the reason i chose the RS... sick and tired of tractor gears at cruising speeds.... 80-85 is just the cat's a$$ with these gears... just downshift when riding slower or using it to tow your Airstream.... This winter I'm putting in 2nd Gen gear set and a Vmax rear on my 1st Gen already have both aquired. I cruise at 80 alot also dont like the high rpms while cruising. I dont mind them if I'm screwing around though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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