dna9656 Posted May 24, 2015 Share #1 Posted May 24, 2015 So I want to solder some OEM wires to OEM wires. When tinning the ends and then heating the 2 ends and adding solder the wires ends don't stick! WASSUPWIDDAT? Do I have to butt connect the wires? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted May 24, 2015 Share #2 Posted May 24, 2015 (edited) Wrong solder? Are you using rosin core? Edited May 24, 2015 by SilvrT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venturous Posted May 24, 2015 Share #3 Posted May 24, 2015 I've always found a proper inline splice (not pigtail) then soldering is best. Followed by shrink wrap. Are you heating the wires or the solder when you do this? You may know more about soldering than I do... but just in case I'll assume you don't. You do know that to solder wires.... you must heat the wires and let them melt the solder... right? Many make the mistake of trying to use the gun to melt the solder and drip onto wires which never works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted May 24, 2015 Share #4 Posted May 24, 2015 Don't just solder the ends together. Start with bare, clean wire, shiny copper, remove about an inch of insulation, twist the copper around each other so that they form a new straight through connection, then solder them to keep them in place, after that shrink on the shrink tubing that you should have put on before all the twisting takes place, and as mentioned you'll need Rosin Core Solder, do not use acid core!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venturous Posted May 24, 2015 Share #5 Posted May 24, 2015 Should look like this not this. heres how... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djh3 Posted May 24, 2015 Share #6 Posted May 24, 2015 Make sure if both ends are closed IE have a connector on them, be sure to put your heat shrink on first to eliminate having to go over a connector or take one apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eck Posted May 24, 2015 Share #7 Posted May 24, 2015 Make sure to put your heat shrink on first to eliminate having to go over a connector or take one apart. It seems that I always have to take it apart to put the shrink tube on...:think: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted May 24, 2015 Share #8 Posted May 24, 2015 It seems that I always have to take it apart to put the shrink tube on...:think: So?????????? isn't that the way it is supposed to be done??? I watched a video once and that's how he did it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djh3 Posted May 24, 2015 Share #9 Posted May 24, 2015 I can tell you that while building the by-pass relays, there have been several times I get one started and then I get the "oh @#$%" and have to un-solder the wires. Partially why I changed my assembly process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dacheedah Posted May 24, 2015 Share #10 Posted May 24, 2015 Put some dielectric grease on them after soldering and slide the hear shrink over, just xtra xtra insurance, i do this for my boat wires Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted May 24, 2015 Share #11 Posted May 24, 2015 Just so you are aware,, dielectric grease does not conduct electricity, and greases up the connection so that re-soldering is out of the question. Now if you twist the wires as suggested you wouldn't de-solder them anyways, but grease does tend to migrate up the wire. Now that same grease will keep out the moisture and that is good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted May 24, 2015 Share #12 Posted May 24, 2015 If water intrusion is an issue, then use what is called "Double Wall" or "Adhesive Lined" (depending on whom you are talking to) shrink tubing. This is shrink tubing that has a coating of hot melt glue on the inside so that the glue melts as the tube is shrinking and completely seals the connection water and air tight. IF you ever need to take the joint apart you can still get it off and the hot melt glue will not contaminate future soldering of the joint. Noting like using the right stuff that is specifically made for the job at hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowpuc Posted May 25, 2015 Share #13 Posted May 25, 2015 Probably sounds crazy but I have found that putting a little flux paste on the wires first, heating it with the iron till its hot enough to sizzle the flux then touching the flux core solder on seems to work best.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patch Posted May 27, 2015 Share #14 Posted May 27, 2015 Probably sounds crazy but I have found that putting a little flux paste on the wires first, heating it with the iron till its hot enough to sizzle the flux then touching the flux core solder on seems to work best.. Recently did some wiring on mine and Cowpuc nailed it, because of the mild corrosion we found in the old wiring we could not get a proper joint without the flux! Patch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobRiguez Posted May 27, 2015 Share #15 Posted May 27, 2015 Also, make sure the tip of your iron is clean and tinned prior to heating the wires as well. This will help transfer heat to the wires faster and keep the new solder on the wires and not stick to the tip. 1 - Try to make sure your hands/fingers are clean and oil free. 2 - Try to expose up to an inch of clean wire. 3 - Cut your heat shrink tube at least 1/4" longer than your bare wire joint. Slide your heat shrink tube on before you twist the wires. Follow the diagram above. 4 - If you have rosin, brush a little on the twisted wire. If you dont have rosin, make sure you have rosin core soldering wire. 5 - Clean, Heat, and tin the tip of your iron 6 - Heat the wire at the twist and try your best to melt the solder into the wire. You should not be touching the iron to the solder at all. 7 - If you have a clumpy mess, try to quickly rub the iron over the joint to smooth the solder out, clean the tip, repeat. 8 - Slide heat shrink over joint, use a flame (I find butane torch or heat gun to work the best) to shrink the tube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #16 Posted May 27, 2015 (edited) Dang TYPOS!!! But it is funny! By-ass relays? I know what a relay is...what did you by-pass? I can tell you that while building the by-pass relays, there have been several times I get one started and then I get the "oh @#$%" and have to un-solder the wires. Partially why I changed my assembly process. Edited May 27, 2015 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted May 27, 2015 Share #17 Posted May 27, 2015 By-ass relays? I know what a relay is...what did you by-pass? No need for you to worry about a by-ass relay or a by-pass relay.... Those are a 2nd gen thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #18 Posted May 27, 2015 (edited) I learn more cool stuff here... dang I never heard of any coating over a solder joint that would perform like that! Well except for solder rosin, can act as a grease sealant in butt-connectors but putting die electric grease ona solder joint prior to shrink tubing, I don't know how that would work. I do KNOW that TOO much rosin gets all over the soldered joint and shrink tube can slide off the joint. I think I saw isopropyl alcohol used to strip rosin off a joint and to clean the surrounding wire insulation...yes? So Jeff where does one find this until now "un-obtainium"? If water intrusion is an issue, then use what is called "Double Wall" or "Adhesive Lined" (depending on whom you are talking to) shrink tubing. This is shrink tubing that has a coating of hot melt glue on the inside so that the glue melts as the tube is shrinking and completely seals the connection water and air tight. IF you ever need to take the joint apart you can still get it off and the hot melt glue will not contaminate future soldering of the joint. Noting like using the right stuff that is specifically made for the job at hand. Edited May 27, 2015 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #19 Posted May 27, 2015 (edited) Venturous' (Gary's) post belongs in the General How To Tech library edited into a "How To" format. Heck maybe the entire thread!!! It's excellent technically, (at least to what I was taught in trade school), well written and is very helpful! The reason first I posted was really a fishing trip I suppose. I have run into crud under wire insulation on vehicles before and I don't like what it holds for our future with our bikes. It (the crud) can get so bad that current won't flow yet the circuit will pass a continuity test with no problems, I didn't do a Resistance check (because as every one knows Resistance is futile) at the time because it didn't occur to me, I just replaced the wire. It wasn't bundled up in a harness like most wires are in a vehicle; it ran from one head light to the other across the core support so no problem. I was expecting an answer talking about the nightmare some of us will face when the corrosion under the wires on our bikes get to a point where the bike's operation is affected. I was afraid I would get a response that said I better be thinking about building a new harness! I think most of us here are aware of this and have had similar exps. like mine. Maybe the fear factor of this issue is so high we don't want to talk about it? No amount of flux on my wires would remove this black corrosion, I had to strip back further than I would have liked to get to shiny wire so I had to go to my spare XVZ harness and harvest some wire to restore the length I needed. I put a soft wire wheel in the drill (sorry Jeff I am out of any fine grit paper!) press and held the exposed wire against the brush while it spun. it was enough. I learned how to make what my teacher called a "Bell Telephone"(?) joint. Well, I think that's what he called it. It is the same joint Gary (Venturous) described above so well. In school we did it with house wire (14? AWG solid not stranded) and it was HUGE as wire joints go. Those joints were so strong it would take a LOT of tension to break the joint; I think the wire would have broken before the joint would have. Anyway another point o bring up here is WHERE are we going to find wire that is marked like the wire in our bikes to replace the corrosion riddled harnesses some of us have. I'm starting to look around, I bet some of you already know where (on the Internet) we can find bulk wire so marked. One last thing why are the crimping pliers for installing blade connectors so expensive? $100.00? REALLY? Do they crimp the barrel (round hollow tube/ pin style) type or any other style terminus used in molex type connectors? I bet it takes 22 different style crimpers to do it properly. Or a wire stripper used very carefully.... Edited August 16, 2015 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #20 Posted May 27, 2015 (edited) SilverT: No I'm using what seems to be the only solder available for electrical work any more.. It says it's rosin core but the core is so small...Back in the day the solder was thicker and you had to press the end shut to keep the rosin in. The most I ever saw was 1 drop, probably from heating more than gravity...anyway...so I bought a can of paste rosin a long time ago and as trained I use just a little... Edited May 28, 2015 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #21 Posted May 27, 2015 That's the warm up/practice round.... It seems that I always have to take it apart to put the shrink tube on...:think: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted May 27, 2015 Author Share #22 Posted May 27, 2015 That's even funnier! ROTFLMAO! No need for you to worry about a by-ass relay or a by-pass relay.... Those are a 2nd gen thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djh3 Posted May 28, 2015 Share #23 Posted May 28, 2015 I guess thats what I get for using the tablet every now and then. It dont always put down what I want. Desktop at least does spell check. But if its the wrong word and spelled correct, it dont tell you that. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbig1 Posted July 3, 2015 Share #24 Posted July 3, 2015 back in the day it was called a western union splice used on telegraph wires. that's the one venturous posted. it had seven wraps per side dang tough. if you take apart a splice on wiring ground on bike they used small copper Ferrell. no solder, as that makes wire stiff and brakes easer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djh3 Posted July 3, 2015 Share #25 Posted July 3, 2015 One last thing why are the crimping pliers for installing blade connectors so expensive? $100.00? REALLY? Do they crimp the barrel (round hollow tube/ pin style) type or any other style terminus used in molex type connectors? I bet it takes 22 different style crimpers to do it properly. Or a wire stripped used very carefully.... Doug, what I have started doing on my ends that are the crimp on type and if I happen to use a crimp connector, I actually heat the plastic outer cover thing and strip it off. Put a piece of heat shrink on the wire and crimp together, then some dielec grease and heat shrink it up. Those big plastic insulators get messy and take up a lot of room. As far as crimpers go I am still using the old $4 pair I have had forever. Not fancy but work well and don't usually over crimp. I did recently buy a pair of "automatic" strippers from harbor freight that work well. They were like $10 or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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