Harley Davidson - now I'm convinced

[cowpuc]

The reasons I would not own a Harley are:

 

1. Over priced when quality is compared.

 

2. I like being a little different.

 

3. The "Harley attitude" turns me off.

 

I was asked once why I didn't support this country and ride a Harley. My reply was, "have you ever heard of the ASHAU VALLEY? I put 11 months in that hell hole so I have enough self confidence to ride any bike I prefer and I prefer my Venture, which by the way, I bought locally." I fly the U.S. flag proudly 24/7!

 

Thanks for your service to our country and protecting our way of life KY Rider!!!

Puc

[Silverado6x6]

I wish Star or Yamaha would just take a leap of consumer fsith and bring back the REAL Venture updatrd with modern gear and Not just another cruiser clone.

[PhilH]

I was asked once why I didn't support this country and ride a Harley.

 

No, HD is NOT made in America

1. The forks are made in Japan

2. The electronics are made in Japan

3. The blingy chrome is made in China

4. The tires are made in Brazil

5. The seats are made in Vietnam or some Asian 3rd-world countries

6. Oh, and the leather jackets, leather bandanas, leather vests, leather pants, leather chaps, leather boots, leather gloves, leather hats with "Harley Davidson" logo on them? All made in China.

 

Thank you for your service, and I'm a Kentuckian too.

[eazyduzzit]

My wife and I ride a Harley Ultra, but we don't ride to "bike night" 5 miles from home, neither of us own any Harley clothing, we don't wear half gloves, do rags, tattoos, eye patches etc. I don't have a long gray pony tail hanging out of my helmet.

 

The fact is, I hate the Harley attitude probably more than you guys, but the brand of motorcycle you ride has nothing to do with it. I've seen just as many posers on other brands. There just seems to be more Harleys out there.

[Eddie]

Thanks Brad , I like the nice way you approached this.

 

My venture was a nice bike but I wanted more, I just cant believe how hung up or jealous some guys are about HDs . Let it go,jeez. The way some of you talk and act are just as bad as the HD people you are stereotyping.

I buy tee shirts for souvenirs all the time, and if they had Yamaha dealers all over the place I would of been there too in the day.

How about a list of Venture problems

clutch whine

bad shock

rear spline noise

sound system sucks

32 mpg

I love the fact that if I ever have a problem I'm not far from a dealer. A Yamaha dealer would have to order your parts, and I never seen just a

Yamaha store

The reason there are so many for sale is because they are the number one selling bike in the world , and you cant compare all the HD models for sale to just one bike the Venture.

[Huggy]

HEY, leave the ponytail ALONE!!!

 

[Eddie]

Oh and to the 4 hour to I have to stop thing , no Venture is going to go 4 hours without stopping either, 1st gens can barly make 2 1/2 hours. I know I have had all these bikes.

[Eddie]

HEY, leave the ponytail ALONE!!!

 

 

and the tats, they were hear long before the HD.

[XV1100SE]

Noticed Freebird has been silent on this. Maybe because he is out shopping for HD clothing???

[djh3]

Harley was smart on another marketing front. They finance thier own brand. They made it easy for the guy walking in to finance one and walk out the door without making 3 trips to different banks. The marketing ploy when the 883 came out was a smart deal in my book. You bought the bike for like

$6999 or whatever and if you traded it in on a bigger HD withing 2 yr I think it was you got the inital price backe less $100 bucks I think. Hows that for making someone brand loyal.

[PhilH]

Thanks Brad , I like the nice way you approached this.

 

My venture was a nice bike but I wanted more, I just cant believe how hung up or jealous some guys are about HDs . Let it go,jeez. The way some of you talk and act are just as bad as the HD people you are stereotyping.

I buy tee shirts for souvenirs all the time, and if they had Yamaha dealers all over the place I would of been there too in the day.

How about a list of Venture problems

clutch whine

bad shock

rear spline noise

sound system sucks

32 mpg

I love the fact that if I ever have a problem I'm not far from a dealer. A Yamaha dealer would have to order your parts, and I never seen just a

Yamaha store

The reason there are so many for sale is because they are the number one selling bike in the world , and you cant compare all the HD models for sale to just one bike the Venture.

 

 

I think this thread is not about hating Harley Davidson motorcycle. I think this thread is about hating the HD attitude (clothing and all). I used to ride with some people who rode Aprillia and Ducati, and they are as snobbish as HD owner about their Italian machines.

 

But they don't buy Chinese-made Ducati hat and Aprillia keychain and start talking Italian and watching Primavera soccers and such.

 

Harley owners do that. They buy their Chinese-made clothings and claim that they are more American than guys who buy "rice burners". This attitude is what make a lot of people hate Harley owners. Sadly, most people hate Harley Davidson motorcycle too.

[Bill Seward]

http://www.goingfaster.com

 

Click on "American Angst"! There is a wealth of Harley™ stuff there. Most of it does a great job of exposing the Harley™ "Lifestyle" as the joke that it is.

 

Some material is not safe for work computers - no dirty pics or anything - but a lot of adult language...

[IH Truck Guy]

1. First,nobody can argue about Willie G. being a marketing guru.

Right or wrong,the Harley lifestyle is important to their customers. Get over it...

 

2.If you look back in history,in the late '70's,Harley developed 12 proto-type bikes called "The Nova Project".

Built in conjunction with Porsche,they were V4 water cooled with belt drive.

Willie G.'s only blunder of his career, was thinking that this bike would drive a wedge between HD and it's hardcore customers..

3.The other reason the program was scrapped, was at that time,HD was cash poor after buying the company back from AMF and spending millions building the EVO platform.

 

Now think about this for a minute.

The '70's and '80's were the big "Buy American" years.

 

IMHO,if HD would have seen this project thru,it's very possible Harley would have captured 90% or better of the motorcycle market.

They would have had a bike for everybody.

We could all be riding Harleys...

 

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSZhTIy507qdEfv9wuq2lE9Edp0nJ_W82OS03LphPfW7dmx59x8

 

If your ever in Milwaukee,stop at the HD museum and you can see one of the 12 proto-types on display.

It's orion silver and blue like my '87 and looks like a cross between a MK1 and a early Goldwing..Pretty cool.

 

http://www.bikerenews.com/AntiqueBikes/CodeNameNova.htm

 

IMHO,HD blew it big time.

Now if I could afford it,would I buy another Harley? You bet....

Would I get rid of our 1st Gen...Nope....

[XV1100SE]

...

Built in conjunction with Porsche,they were V4 water cooled with belt drive.

Willie G.'s only blunder of his career, was thinking that this bike would drive a wedge between HD and it's hardcore customers..

...

IMHO,if HD would have seen this project thru,it's very possible Harley would have captured 90% or better of the motorcycle market.

 

When they came out with the VRod people complained that it wasn't a "Harley". And if you look at the different models they have, they have something for everyone.

 

As for market share, if you look at the number of Harley's on the road compared with other brands I think they do have the majority, especially in the States. Can't go thru a small town without there being a Harley dealer. We've only seen 3 Yamaha dealers during our trip. I tried to find sales numbers but by the number of bikes you see, HD is the leader. Did find one stat for Australia which showed they had the top 3 bikes in sales of touring/cruiser models.

[KICKSHOT]

Funny I own one of each. RSTD and Electra Glide Ultra Classic. Funny I have owned both brands before. Funny I also own t-shirts from Harley and Yamaha. Funny both my bikes have after market loud pipes. Funny they both have good and bad points. This whole thread is funny.

kickshot

[Silverado6x6]

I posted my comment while at the Bingo hall last night from my cellphone, thats why you see those funny typos, but what I enjoy the most is riding my restored 89 Venture Royale around and all I see is jaw drops and head turns because up here in Alaska I cannot remember seeing another one at all, being unique is the most satisfying part of it, any geek, nerd, sex or ethnic group can waltz into a HD shop, heck I have one a quarter mile from where I work, they can all buy the same bike, buy the same clothes and are now part of the fraternity, well in some parts of the world they require you by law to wear the same style and color of clothes, where has creative individuality anymore?

 

people buy the clothes to be part of the herd, if not the herd will not allow them to graze with the others, its just like nature.

 

But then you have the true radical freedom loving individuals that absolutely will not become hypnotized by incessant hyped buying slogans or incentives. Are these the real people or has society morphed or is evolving into Elysium, where the better lives higher, cleaner and longer?

 

So I ride a 24 year old bike, it has plastic panels on it, would be terribly ugly without them, has a near silent engine, does not need 60w motor oil nor does it demand to be shod in leather fringe, its a throwback to a decade that may have had the best music but the worst in cars. Its almost reminds me of a Russian MIG fighter jet, all angles and dangles, nothing at all like the sleek cocoon encased modern Goldwings or the now marketed cruiser era we are now in. I head down to the yammy store, all their Star brands are basically cruisers from the top on down, I know because I own a 2009 Star 1300 Tourer, and I hate it, when its paid for I may sell it off, and if I have to travel outside Alaska I will and I will find me some more Ventures.

[Wade 2000]

Funny I own one of each. RSTD and Electra Glide Ultra Classic. Funny I have owned both brands before. Funny I also own t-shirts from Harley and Yamaha. Funny both my bikes have after market loud pipes. Funny they both have good and bad points. This whole thread is funny.

kickshot

 

Ride what you like, wear what you want and opinions are like hemorrhoids, every a--hole will eventually have one.

[JohnT]

I just like riding motorcycles. I like it a lot. Right now I ride as Gen1 MK II. Love it.

If I tell my cousin I am coming to Ohio next week before the WNY rally he will break out his other Harley and let me ride it to Austintown and then to McMennimys. If I surprise him I go on my VR.

Either way I get to see friends and eat chicken wings.

And at QS+L I bet no one else travels 450 miles for wings. So I will might another lottery ticket.

[IronMike]

On the four hours thing, Most all bikes (Always a rule breaker) are from the factory to go close to 200 miles on a tank with one up. AND have a load carrying capacity of Close to 400 LBS, Give or take 25 LBS or Miles per tank. Size does not matter. You can load a Rebel 250 with 326 lbs. Its a rule breaker but I am refering to bikes you would take on a long trip.

 

And provided the tires have proper air. SOOOO many people ride underinflated, A low tire gets hot and bursts faster than a fully aired up one.

 

Anyways. I want to say I like, HDs and LOVE the looks of black ones. I have seen a lot well kept and appointed. With me what I hate is the Loud pipe, obnoxious, throttle rocking noise maker, bar hopping drunks that think they are real riders when they are nothing more than rebels who are taking our liberty's of bike riding from us. Who got us kicked out of Myrtle beach? And to be fair the crotch rockets are doing the same.

 

And far as Freebird, He's a Real Bike Rider and we know that, so he is exempt and I think he kind knows he's not in the part of the HD crowd we are talking about. I think he has run into some.

 

If they built a great bike for a great price we all would have one, I bought a 07 Roadstar because it was like 10G cheaper than a Harley and looked and sounded the same. No one has ever called it a Yamaha, even HD riders mistake it for one, I laugh my But off. "Wow, lots of custom work on that!" Its on my profile. Too new to Venture to have a pic yet, September!

[Red Ryder]

Hey, owning both a RSV and H-D Ultra I will say this. Those of you that know me, know that I loved my Yamies, especially the RSV. But, after the accident I had to sell my "Sweet Thing", it broke my heart. I had always, I mean since a kid when my older brother owned them, liked the looks and sound of a Harley. As Squid has mentioned Yamaha basically dropped the ball on touring, and it is a shame because I feel the V-Four is the best engine ever made. Take a look at the XCT (Victory Cross Country Tour), they did everything that Yamaha Should Have Done (except air cooled v twin), a Fantastic Bike. On the H-D, they have came along way and many of my Harley friends have 100,000+ miles on their bikes. Yes, H-D is a Advertising Genuis, I mean one of the Greatest Marketing ever, but more than that, Harley it is a Brotherhood that is respected worldwide. Would I want to go on a 6000 mile, 12 day ride, like I did in 08 on the RSV, except with the Harley Ultra, well probably No. The RSV is smoother Stock than the Harley would be even with upgrades. But, then again, my Ultra is a 2008 and not a 2009 and newer with the upgraded engine and frame, which I have been told is a big improvement.

I still proudly wear my Venture Patches on my vest which is full of place, events and miles rode. Even being a Michigan Biker with Horrible Roads, I still have put 100k+ on my bikes since 04, most of those miles where on Yamies, so to tell you the truth I would love to see Yamaha come out with an updated RSV. But better hurry, because in 2015 when Harley puts the Liquid Cooled Engine in the Touring Frame it will be another marketing genius. Just my 2cents, Later-

[slowrollwv]

1. First,nobody can argue about Willie G. being a marketing guru.

Right or wrong,the Harley lifestyle is important to their customers. Get over it...

 

2.If you look back in history,in the late '70's,Harley developed 12 proto-type bikes called "The Nova Project".

Built in conjunction with Porsche,they were V4 water cooled with belt drive.

Willie G.'s only blunder of his career, was thinking that this bike would drive a wedge between HD and it's hardcore customers..

3.The other reason the program was scrapped, was at that time,HD was cash poor after buying the company back from AMF and spending millions building the EVO platform.

 

Now think about this for a minute.

The '70's and '80's were the big "Buy American" years.

 

IMHO,if HD would have seen this project thru,it's very possible Harley would have captured 90% or better of the motorcycle market.

They would have had a bike for everybody.

We could all be riding Harleys...

 

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSZhTIy507qdEfv9wuq2lE9Edp0nJ_W82OS03LphPfW7dmx59x8

 

If your ever in Milwaukee,stop at the HD museum and you can see one of the 12 proto-types on display.

It's orion silver and blue like my '87 and looks like a cross between a MK1 and a early Goldwing..Pretty cool.

 

http://www.bikerenews.com/AntiqueBikes/CodeNameNova.htm

 

IMHO,HD blew it big time.

Now if I could afford it,would I buy another Harley? You bet....

Would I get rid of our 1st Gen...Nope....

 

Dan go back further and you will see that Harley sold or made a deal to Japan to build the bike there. Japan had bought the rights and machinery to make the bike ,but not under the Harley name plate. This was in the early to late 30's. Harley polled the plug when Japan invaded China in 38 or 39.

[10spd]

One of the guys I was riding with today told me about a used gold wing he had been looking at. We stopped to look at it. I think he is going to get it. He has an old shovel head HD. His words were I want to ride not fix it every other weekend.

[Barrycuda]

I hit the link sent by Bill Seward. for better or worse, this chap goes OFF on HD

 

http://www.goingfaster.com/angst/noharley2.html

[IH Truck Guy]

Dan go back further and you will see that Harley sold or made a deal to Japan to build the bike there. Japan had bought the rights and machinery to make the bike ,but not under the Harley name plate. This was in the early to late 30's. Harley polled the plug when Japan invaded China in 38 or 39.

 

See,I learn new things everyday.

Sure I'm glad I got the Interweb instead of those encyclopedias..

[RSTDdog]

Seriously though I can remember when HD had some seriously troubled bikes and thats only going back to the late 60 mid 70 range. Oil leaks engine problems at 20-30k etc. Then they decided to sell out to the bowling ball company, geez then the stuff was made in Japan when that wasnt a good place to manufacture druable goods.

 

You're off a few decades with Japans quality period. Harley's quality issues under AMF were mostly management derived more so than supplier issues and I'd have to do some research, but AMF wasn't sourcing parts from Japan, other than perhaps forks, shocks and carbs (Showa,mikuni). And the 70's and 80's were Japans manufacturing rise. Some of the best quality equipment from stereos to cars were coming from Japan. Keep in Mind it was Honda (Particularly the CB 750), Yamaha and Kawasaki Motorcyles that put the hurting on Harley ( and Triumph, BSA , Norton ,etc) that forced the sale to AMF. Part of the recovery when it was bought back by the employees was Tarriffs on all imported motorcycles over 750cc to protect HD. Again research, but this is when you saw the influx of 700cc Japanese bikes. To Harleys credit they actually petitioned congress themselves to lift those tariffs when they were solvent and profitable. Without the Tariffs, they would likely have not made it.

 

Like my brother has said when AMF bought HD they ruined the bike and have never regained what quality they had prior to AMF. And to think of it that's what really turned me off of the HD. The quality went down the toilet and HD has never gotten back to the level of quality they where at before AMF.

 

 

No offense here, but I'm guessing you have not ridden a pre- AMF and post AMF Harley back to back for any extended period of time lately. Antique value not withstanding, but given the choice between riding a 1969 FL and a 1999 FL cross country, I'd take the 99 EVO every time. Nostalgia is good and I am fan of the good ole days as much as anyone, but we really weren't building things better back then.

 

I recently rented an HD electra glide in Hawaii, and have to say there was alot Iliked about it. The one I had had a cable clutch, which I didn't like,neutral hard to find and Hot inspite of the temperate Hawaii climate, but the stability and the handling of the bike was great. For some of the technical riding we did (two up) I was more comfortable on that bike after 50 miles than on my RSTD I have put over 13,000 miles on.

 

I'd consider one if they build a touring bike with a liquid cooled motor and unit transmission. And yes I'd buy probably buy a T shirt too.