riding on gravel??

[waterbug]

I dont know were to post this but have a question, I was leaving my parents lastnight and for some reason the last 30ft of there drive is gravel because they didnt want it all the way to road dont have a clue why but any way started to stop at the end and was marbels and the front tire rolled out from under me and I dropped it with my girl friend on the back, thank you crash bars no one was hurt. Any suggestions on how to ride on these so I dont do this again. Thanks for any advise

[RedRider]

The RSV is quite the large dual-sport machine. You may want to look at putting some knobbies on the front.

 

Seriously though, riding gravel is like walking on ice. You have to be very careful, don't make sudden moves, and the moves you make need to be small. Momentum is important as starting and stopping seems to give the most trouble. Try not to stop unless you are exactly straight up so your foot does not slide out on the gravel trying to support a lean. Watch for piles of gravel. If the drive is well levelled, you should be OK. The piles and ruts are dangerous.

 

And, if you can do it, the key to getting out of a front tire washout on gravel is to give it throttle. It lightens the front end and pulls the tire out. It is really difficult to do (mentally) on such a big bike.

 

Glad no one was hurt and hope the bike was spared any rash.

 

RR

[T.J.]

Don't use the front brake when you get into the gravel. You should be OK. Make sure the front tire is straight when you take off. Have fun next time you go over.

[loehring]

Show up some weekend and pave a 4 ft path in their drive. That should take care of the problem.

[PBJ]

Usually i find it best to slow as much as possible ( in a situation like you were in ) and feet down and low throttle "walk " the bike across the stones using feet as out riggers but the throttle to move the bike. Because it was a driveway i'm sure you felt the need to stop completely to check for traffic. Slower the better because as said before momentum can take the bike from one side to the other and the gravel will roll under your feet.

 

This is also something to look out for at intersections as well ,especially in the early spring when they are filled with left over gravel and undisolved salt granuales. They may not even be noticable but can cause a foot to slide out from under you and over you go.

 

All the wonderfull things to redicover in motorcycling Waterbug. Be safe and enjoy all the experiences. Hope you and your Lady are okay.

[Royal Venturer]

If I keep my knee slightly bent and foot on the side that the rear tends to drift , bring up the RPM's I use a controlled approach.....like this!

Now this doesn't work unless your cajones are large and your brain is small.

[2RDLX]

My wife says that is how I ride all the time.LOL

[SteveW]

My Driveway it long and down hill from the paved road and all gravel. What works for me is if youe are going down hill keep it in first and take it slow ( only use back brake ).

Going uphill I let my legs dangle at the side of the bike just off the ground and keep the throttle up so the bike does not stall. a few have droped their bikes at the top of my drive because the bike stalled and they grabed the front brake.

[ahoutzer]

Show up some weekend and pave a 4 ft path in their drive. That should take care of the problem.

 

Loehring has the only really good answer. Gravel is NOT a road surface -- it is a road HAZARD! It combines the characteristics of marbles and broken glass -- making a person lose control and fall, then cutting the person to shreds.

 

Pave it. Can you just ride through their yard, in the dirt or grass? Most anything is better than gravel.

[wizard]

I hate gravel!

[scotty]

I have 2 miles of gravel to the nearest pavement. When I was younger it was 15 miles.

There are some tricks to staying upright.

Any body want me to list them?

Scotty

[OB-1]

I get a lot of experience riding on gravel since it’s 4+ miles to the nearest pavement and substantially longer in any other direction. The RSV, like any other big bike, can be a handful on gravel. It’s harder to control a bike in deep gravel, so stay to wheel paths compacted by other traffic. Riding through deep gravel just plan sucks, so try to avoid it. Deep gravel requires slow speeds, direct steering, (as opposed to counter steering), no front brake, and judicious use of the throttle.

Places where gravel and pavement meet, like intersections, are particularly dangerous because the gravel tends to act like marbles under your tires and feet. Slow, deliberate control inputs are required here and no or little front brake. Slow down before approaching these areas and be prepared for your bike to slide a bit.

 

My biggest complaint concerning the gravel roads I must ride on is that it’s impossible to keep a Midnight RSV clean.

[rod]

There are some tricks to staying upright.

Any body want me to list them?

Scotty>

 

Yes we can compare notes. Riding on gravel, keep speed moderate and don't do any thing radical; sudden turns,stopping or accelerating. Stopping, keep your front wheel straight and little or no front brake. When riding slow use the friction zone to control speed, rather than throttle or brakes. Add more tips please. Rod

[scotty]

Some of the terminoligy I use here is made up becuase I don't think it exists.

1: speed- try not to go too slow (under 20 Km/H) You can't maintian a line that slow. I usually travel 60Km/h unless the road is in good shape.

 

2: Find a car tire track and follow it. Shift your weight on the bike to keep the bike upright and steer to stay in the track. When looking for traffic or other stuff, keep glances as breif as possible. If you loose sight of the specific track you are following it can be hard to pick up again. It takes a lot of concentration.

 

3: to move to a differant part of the road look for a track that wanders across the one you are in and follow that one across to the new line. Don't cross a high ridge at any speed. Lower ridges can be crossed at lower speeds. Cross them deliberatly.

 

4: be carefull in truck tracks. They leave a nice foot print but can make high ridges and the possibility of double ridging. (the front tire on the left side of the ridge and the rear on the right. It will then swap sides violently over and over.) The venture is not as violent as a smaller bike but it will still knock your feet off the pegs.

 

5: avoid sheered gravel. ( this is just after the grader has gone by and has scraped the gravel from one side and spread it across the road.) It looks inviting because there are no rocks there but I have found it to be unstable and very unpredictable. If you out here SLOW DOWN.

 

6: riding 2 up- The wife stays solid with the bike for the duration. I am usually doing quite a dance on the bike. See #2

 

7: cross winds. They will blow you out of your track faster than you can compensate. Slow down.

 

8: mini highways. These are wide tacks (12" or so) on higher traffic roads. no loose rocks.

Put your feet up and relax. Watch out for pot holes.

 

9: low light. Driving into the sun or at night the tracks of 1 specific car are difficult or impossible to see. Drive by feel. You can feel even a tiny ridge, shift weight to stay up and steer away from it.

 

I hope this makes sense, I can be a scatter brain when typing.

Scotty

[BOO]

Lots of good suggestions here.

Years ago when I started riding I had a couple of miles to the slab. Also lots of my friends were on gravel roads so I have ridden some on the gravel.

As a matter of fact I was on some gravel last weekend with my youngest son that probably has never ridden on gravel.

Simple rules are keep the speed up, don't just crawl or you will be crawling out from under the bike, 15-20 miles an hour is fine.

Use the tracks if possible.

I use my legs for outriggers for balance AND it helps me off the bike if it goes down.

Stay loose in the saddle, if the bike wants to take off in some direction, don't just jerk it back but just follow it and start correcting it as you go.

It's not one of my favorite things to do but don't be afraid of riding on gravel.

How about steel grates on bridges in the rain with pretty steep approaches? Oh now that gets my attention.

Shiny side up,

Jerry

[waterbug]

Thanks for all the info and yes it helps and explains what I think I did was at the end of the drive I must have hit the front alittle harder than I thought in some small pebbles and the tire just rolled over and I was almost stopped. I am glad she has the crash bars I wouldnt want the 863lbs on our leggs. Luckly no body was hurt and no damage but a very good lesson learned. Bad side of it is my mom and dad hate bikes and dont like me having it even though I am 41 I still hear about them and it had to happen there with them watching oh joy!!

[CrazyHorse]

Im a big advocate of front brake use but not on gravel the front tire washes out to easily.

[Kandaje]

Greetings...

 

Driving a bike on gravel (or wet grass) is like driving a car on ice, or a boat on water...

 

It's about balance control, knowing when, where, and how much it's going to slide out from under you, and NOT panicing. In other words - Practice...

 

At first, it's very scary, but the more you do it, the more confident and competent you get. So find a place and practice until the butterflies in your belly go away. Both 1 and 2 up. Load up a backpack to simulate a backseat passenger if 'SHE' doesn't want to practice with you - But 'she' really should!

 

I think the best pieces of advice I've seen so far in this thread are - Don't go TOO slow - you can't hold a line, and don't go too fast. Basicly, always be prepared to hit the dirt and choose your speed appropriately. And take your hand OFF that front brake lever, the very last thing you want to happen is your forks diving down when you start rolling over because the front wheel is just pushing rocks, and NOT actually steering...

 

Stay off the crested piles, and follow a track if you can see one. If you have to cross a pile, do it straight up with the wheel straight, or be prepared for the slide and the obligitory countersteer, tossing your weight to the high side, prepared to step off and roll if she does go down.

 

Be aware that any depth of deep gravel is like quicksand to a bike - you have absolutely NO traction and no support - It's worse than Ice - At least Ice supports the weight, unless of course you are driving over a lake on thin ice...

 

If the road is also rutted - go another way if possible. Ruts are even MORE dangerous than gravel, you can get trapped really fast, and tossed off the bike - because you have just lost ALL balance control. Avoid the temptation of putting your feet down at any speed greater than stopped unless you are slowly walking it, That's a good way to break your ankles - especially if you do it in a panic.

 

You'll be instantly surprised just how easy it is to permanently high-center a Venture on a rutty road, when you discover that the rut you were following now goes into the ditch - and you tried to climb over it! Tow truck time...

 

Here, Let me show you how I know!

http://i33.tinypic.com/hueflx.jpg

Approx: location - 30 1/2 and C road in Grand Junction Co..

 

The actual road? The green fuzzy stuff with the lumpy things, between the bike and the fence line...

 

The tractor trail to the right looks mighty inviting - but there is no way to get there other than through the ditch...

The tree line at the end of the 'road' is 31 rd - 1/2 mile away.

 

This happened at about walking speed, because I got trapped in a rut, lost balance, put my feet down and lost any ability to control balance when I did, throttled a tad too much to get out of the rut, was going too slow to maintain my line on that track just above the ditch and hit the front brake in a panic stop. The front end dove down, the edge collapsed and the front tire dropped into the ditch...

 

I basicly violated every principle mentioned in this thread in about 2 seconds...

 

But this WAS a practice ride - I went out there deliberately - not to get stuck, but to practice in a place where I COULDN'T really get hurt or even hurt the bike! - much even IF I screwed up really bad - which I did!! Dramaticly! The only damage - a couple of easily repaired fairing tabs when my knee slid into the lower right side. Total cost: a 12 pack of Fosters for my father in law for pulling me out, and about $4 for a tube of Devcon, and i had to clean the camera lens for my GF. (you can see the mud streak)

 

Which is the point of my post - Practice!!!

 

Practical training!

 

Don't be afraid to practice! You'll be a better rider for it, and you'll know what to do and what to expect and what you'll need, and who to call - when the bad stuff happens for real!

 

And have fun!

Edited July 16, 2008 by Kandaje

[royalstarjac]

When turning or adjusting your line, lean the bike but keep your body upright.-Jack

[RedRider]

Bad side of it is my mom and dad hate bikes and dont like me having it even though I am 41 I still hear about them and it had to happen there with them watching oh joy!!

 

Don't give up on the folks yet. My Mother refused to have anything to do with bikes in her household. I moved out, got married, and got the same BS from the wife. At 40, divorced, and bought my 2000 RSV (first bike ever).

 

All of a sudden, my brother and Dad noticed Mom still loved me. They got bikes also. I take a trip with my Dad every year and make memories I wouldn't have without the bike. My Mom even took a trip 2 up with me last year. It was a great long weekend.

 

My guess is if you can get your Mom to ride around with you and feel safe, your Dad will come around. Just don't have your Mom get on until you are safely out of the gravel driveway.

 

Ride Safe.

 

RR

[waterbug]

I am glad your mom came around but my mom wont shes sure anyone that rides them will die on them. I got a divorce and the ex now runs with the Harley crowd and by that I mean the ones that are better than everyone else and you have to have only certain ones or you arent accepted. And now with her riding and me back at it dear old mom knows my kids are going to be with out parents and the world is going to end and so on. Personally I dont care what you ride or what you do as long as you enjoy yourself and dont hurt anyone.

Thanks for the info everyone you have helped me and hopefully anyone else who has looked maybe a little.

[Marcarl]

If you have taken training then this info won't surprise you none:

As mentioned, stay loose, let the bike have it's way with you and try to 'enjoy' the flopping around it might do. If it decides to go left, ride with it, and then temper it, and then correct it. If an oncoming car is going to give you a hassel, keep going left to get out of the way, going right all of a sudden will only put you down and out.

 

Keep your head up, meaning that you will go where you look, so if that's close to the bike, that's where your distination is, so look up to where you are going, where you want to be, and then ride baby, ride, slow speed of course.

[cmiles3]

Lots of good advice. Your particular problem wasn't riding on gravel, but stopping on gravel. Sounds like you were looking at traffic, not looking straight ahead while stopping. If you do that, you'll lean the bike as you slow; when the front wheel skids while leaning, you found out what happens. This is a bad habit, that you can get away with on dry pavement- but it will bite you when traction is poor (ask me how I know).

 

Slow down before stopping; use lower gears and stay off the front brake- tough to do with Ventures with linked brakes.

 

Keep it straight up, pointing straight ahead- this gives you a few nano seconds to regain traction before it slides out from under you. If you look at the place you want to stop, this will help. But don't look at the mud puddle or you'l end up there instead.

 

Rode 20 miles of dry gravel roads yesterday; if you maintain speed 10-15 mph, the gyro effects of the spinning wheels will keep you upright, even as the wheels wander from side to side, following ruts, slipping sideways off gravel.

 

Soft conditions are tougher; deep gravel, loose sand, mud. Best to stay out of those.

 

Potholes are bad. Really bad. When faced with no other choice, try riding on the line that skirts the edges of the potholes. It's usually harder, drier, and smoother than riding through the middle.

 

Ruts are bad. Deep ruts are really bad. Maintain your speed, try gearing down, stay off the brakes, climb out when you can with a slow steady throttle.

 

Curves are OK, but now is not the time to practice peg scraping. If the gravel rolls out from under your tires while in a dramatic lean, you're going to scrape something higher than your pegs. Maintain speed, but slow enough to make the curve in a more upright position than you typically use on dry pavement.

 

Conditions change in short distances; packed, hard surface, followed by rutted, potholed sections, followed by deep gravel, back to hard packed- expect the worst, and ride that way.

[mbrood]

My experience has already been reflected above... a VERY high pucker factor and I barely raise off the saddle, just slightly more on my feet and HELP the bike find it's way through. You can't force a straight line and you can't force it not to dance around on the marbles, it's a dance, just not the fun kind. Did I mention the pucker factor?

 

As was said, the front brake is the exact tool to use to dump it... I don't even touch it in gravel or sand and sand can actually be worse, changing from hard pack to fluffy... now THAT is a wheel grabber and there isn't much to be done if you didn't avoid it first, but with SMOOTH power control you can get through an aweful lot. Remember it's a dance and you can get through a lot more than you thought. Treat it like a road and you get to take a closer look.

 

Remember.. if THEY did it... we can...

 

http://bergall.org/temp/plank%20road.jpg

[eazyduzzit]

My driveway is at the bottom of a hill and it's gravel. Naturally I get plenty of practice turning left into it. I always try to make most of the turn on the blacktop before my front wheel actually hits the loose stuff. before I hit it I am looking at the line I'm going to take and try to be straight up when I enter the driveway. I follow the car tracks until I get to the back of my wife's car.

By then the garage door is almost up and I'm skating in the loose gravels trying to get around her car and into the garage. It's really a matter of practice.