Rick Butler Posted January 31, 2008 Share #1 Posted January 31, 2008 Well Friends, I have finally decided to go ahead and start packaging my Speedway Proportioning Valve and Galfer stainless brake line to be sold to VentureRiders. I have done this franky because I got pissed off and decided that I just needed to "Just do it"! But before get to the details, I need to tell a story. I came to this realization after coming back from a week of riding with my friends in the Big Bend area of Texas.......where we left a close friend in the hospital in Odessa, TX with a collapsed lung, bruised ribs, a ruptured spleen and a slight concusion. This accident happened on a new Tour Deluxe that only had about 500 miles on it. And the sad fact was that my friend had just come off of a FJR and still owned a GL1800, but fell in love with the way the TD rode. However he was not yet accustomed to the rear brake. His close friend had told me that he had already locked up the rear several times so he knew about the sensitivity of this brake. And in hindsight, I know I should have spent some time with him the evening before our ride to reinforce the proper braking on this bike, but I didn't. Regardless that next morning we took off from Study Butte and headed down the River Road to Presidio. And after we left Lajitas, it was nothing but a fabulous road that just "rocked and rolled" all the way to Presidio. We were about half way there when we came upon a slight 50mph curve that broke right on top of a small rise and was basically blind until you toped the rise. Well Murph entered this curve in the right track (early entry) and came into the apex of the curve on the center line (out high). I guess it startled him and he hit the rear brake, slide for about 10 ft, let off the brake where the bike high sided and slammed him into the road where he slide into an unconscious crumpled pile on the shoulder. Well we managed to get him comfortable while we waited on an ambulance, where they cut all of his clothes off, stabilzed and loaded him up for an ambulance ride to Presidio where a CareFlite was waiting to take him to Odessa. So for the next 2 days until we got home, I was internalizing the entire episode knowing that it could have been prevented (1.) with the right information about this bike and (2.) with a modified rear brake. Murph was a seasoned rider that I have spent countless miles riding with him over the past years, but he just wasn't used to this bike. Well, in the past few months I have both assisted in helping folks build and install the components of my proportioning valve themselves as well as making the modification to the valve, putting it together with the Galfer stainless line myself and then sending the completed package to folks that have asked me. And for bikes that are local friends of mine, I have installed several sets myself. So now because of Murph's accident, I have decided to start putting kits together for sale. When all of this started I wasn't that interested putting these components together into a so called product. But when I did I decided to only charge for the cost of the components and only $10 for my time, which came out to $130 delivered. However because most of us like the ease of using PayPal, this eats into that $10 for $4.07. So I have just ordered the components for 5 more sets (one of which is already spoken for) of which I'm going to sell for $140 delivered to anywhere in the US, which I think is a fair price. The entire kit fits perfectly into a small 5.5" X 8.5" Priority Mail box. Yeah, I know that applying proper braking techniques of using more front brake sooner will certainly take care of this issue, but sometimes your right leg and foot has a mind of its own and does something stupid. And when the rear tire starts sliding on this big bike, it's not a very good feeling. Because if you don't get off of it soon enough, the rear is going to start coming around. Then if you let off too late the bike will high side, which is going to hurt. This adjustable proportioning valve will provide that 1 or 2 second of cushion when the brake pedal is jabbed before all of that brake fluid makes its way to the 4 pistons in the rear caliper. So I'll list this in the Classified Section tomorrow and let's see what happens, Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squidley Posted January 31, 2008 Share #2 Posted January 31, 2008 Thanks for the effort Rick, sorry to hear of your friend. I know Don has your valve on his '99 and seems to like it. I do hope that you get everything you want out of this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crash Posted January 31, 2008 Share #3 Posted January 31, 2008 Thanks Rick. Thoughts are with your friend for a speedy recovery. I'm still waiting for the nice and warm weather here in Ohio to get mine installed that I got from you a while back. Randy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vance Posted January 31, 2008 Share #4 Posted January 31, 2008 What's the installation process like? Are they easy to install? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted January 31, 2008 Share #5 Posted January 31, 2008 Very easy to install. The hardest part is bleeding the brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tartan Terror Posted January 31, 2008 Share #6 Posted January 31, 2008 Rick I was hoping you would put the mod together for sale. You put so much work into the research that you need to get credit. Im just sorry that your friend got hurt and that was the factor that prompted you to make this decision. Kit- I realize that now you are in the glow of the new Wing but keep in mind that constant comments saying this is the worst bike when only a short time ago this was the best bike are only gonna make people pissed. Keep in mind this is a Venture site and we happen to be here cuz we love the Venture. We really dont need to be told all the time it sucks by someone who just didnt have it fir his style. Stay and enjoy the riding and company but please stop bashing the bike I love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stardbog Posted January 31, 2008 Share #7 Posted January 31, 2008 Sorry Scott, But Kit has a good point, Practice is King of safety, in most situations. Sorry for Rick's friend and wish him speedy recovery. Rick's Friend is made few bad decisions, to get on day trip and not become complete familiar with new ride. Emergency stopping is all about knowing well your bike, and their performance. I Don't have Rick's, or any mode on my venture, But I'm Spend some money for ERC Expirence Rider Course. In the Begining $185.00 looks to me as waist of money, but instructors are teach me exacly where was my weeknes, and on the end of course my filling was best $185 ever spent. Of corse You can doit yourself with "Ride Like Pro" DVD instructions, but thats not a same. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted January 31, 2008 Share #8 Posted January 31, 2008 I've taken the ERC course. I've also practiced a LOT. Both help but NEITHER are enough to overcome the simple fact that the brakes on the rear of the RSV are simply too sensitive. PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE...AND...install Rick's system. Cover all your bases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Butler Posted January 31, 2008 Author Share #9 Posted January 31, 2008 Dan, I totally agree with the majority of what you are reccomending. And I have taken the MSF ERC and ARC courses so many times in the last 20 years (the last one was 2-up) that I have lost count. I usually take one with my group every 4 years or so just to help out new riders, etc. However the MSF and what Jerry Palladino teaches does NOT prepare you for an emergency stop at a speed higher than say 30mph. It's my position now after all of my inadvertent mishaps, that if you are going to drive 80, then you need to be able to stop at 80 Not many of us have the fortitude to clamp down on the binders and stop at this speed (or even 60). However I have done so countless times since I changed out the rear caliper and then after installing the proportioning valve (even pulling a trailer with my wife on the bike) and this piece of equipment makes a world of difference in coming to a controlled high speed stop. With just the 2-piston rear caliper I would still get a chirp out of the rear wheel, but after adding the proportioning valve, it took all of that anxiety away. And I'm not really trying to pitch this devise as much as I'm trying to help out folks so they don't have to go through what I have, before they inadvertenly have to deal with the the rear tire squalling with rear end coming around to meet the front. In defense of this bike with the good and the bad, my wife and I will ride it until the wheels fall off of it. In fact after my last mishap, I seriously considered taking advantage to todays brake technology and get a K1200LT or a GL1800 with linked ABS brakes. But I chose to go with the proportioning valve solution so we could keep this RSV that we have had a serious and close relationship with since 2000. JMHO, Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orrin Posted January 31, 2008 Share #10 Posted January 31, 2008 Rick, sorry about your friend. I really hope he comes out of it OK. Please believe that I know the feeling. I will be ordering one of your brake modes in the very near future, just need to get a couple more pay checks under my belt since getting back to work full time. Thanks for all you do! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarges46 Posted January 31, 2008 Share #11 Posted January 31, 2008 I know that I would love to have this set up...in fact two of them if I could figure out how to make one set adapt for Marilyns vstar. Right now I just cant afford to get the things. Once things settle a little with my new to me trailer and getting Marilyns bike a hitch and wired and the intercom installed....gees what a list! Anyway...Rick...I hope you will make more later for those odd ones like me that just cant manage it right now. It is a good thing you do (as mentioned earlier)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmxndad Posted February 1, 2008 Share #12 Posted February 1, 2008 Rick made one up for me last week. This weekends project is the brake valve. I am a novice mechanic at best. I will leave a post on how the installation went for me. Rick, Sorry to hear about your friend. Thanks for getting the parts to me so fast. Ross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Butler Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share #13 Posted February 1, 2008 Sarge, I think you had mentioned your wifes V-Star on another post. And I looked at the fiche and since it's attached with a standard 10mm X 1.25 pitch banjo bolt, I think this valve would work, but I'd need to look at a bike more closely to see how much room we would have under the boards, etc. Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flb_78 Posted February 1, 2008 Share #14 Posted February 1, 2008 I like the brakes on the Venture. I don't know what the problem is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddyRich Posted February 1, 2008 Share #15 Posted February 1, 2008 With panic comes adrenaline. Which will increase strength. So during a panic stop you will normally hit that rear brake too hard and lock the rear wheel. Thanks Rick, I'll be ordering one later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmxndad Posted February 3, 2008 Share #16 Posted February 3, 2008 Install was fairly easy. Kind of a hassle to get at the one line grommet/bracket on the underside of the bike under all the AIS junk. I ended up removing all the AIS stuff and plugging the ports and that made it much easier to get to that grommet/bracket. With Rick's instructions and the slick job he does on these valves, I highly reccomend it. I drove the bike a little with valve at 2 turns out and seems to help. I will need to leather up and really go out and tromp on the brake at speed a couple of times and see if I need to change the setting. Thanks again Rick. Ross Sorenson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarges46 Posted February 3, 2008 Share #17 Posted February 3, 2008 Sarge, I think you had mentioned your wifes V-Star on another post. And I looked at the fiche and since it's attached with a standard 10mm X 1.25 pitch banjo bolt, I think this valve would work, but I'd need to look at a bike more closely to see how much room we would have under the boards, etc. Rick Thanks for thinking of us Rick. Right now I cant look under the bike...it is stored with my other two in very tight quarters. I would have to remove the 1st gen. then hers to have a look. There is nothing but snow outside of the shed they are in. Looks like a wait until spring anyway. But this may work by the sounds of it. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Butler Posted February 3, 2008 Author Share #18 Posted February 3, 2008 Hey Sarge, Since it's a problem, I'll just take a look at the VStar 1100 the next time I'm down at the dealership, which will be next week. Then I'll let you know what I think. Stay warm, Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoutman Posted February 3, 2008 Share #19 Posted February 3, 2008 I ordered a Butler Mod kit. Looking forward to taming that rear brake. The folks on this site that have recommended practice are spot on. When you're in a pinch you're reactions are going to go to what you have practiced. Anybody that likes to drive sports cars should do the same. I took my wife out to breakfast in the T-bird this morning. We had a bit of rain last night and the roads were still wet. Texas has the slickest wet roads I've ever dirven. Took a tight corner that I can normally take at 30 mph, and the back end broke out. I turned into the skid, straightened it out and had a good laugh, but if I had hit the binders I could have easily rolled it. The dang traction control wouldn't let me drift so my only option was to stay steady on the throttle and steer out of the skid. Having practiced that on the skid pad called winter in Utah in a VW, I just did what my muscle memory told me to do. Next weekend I'm going to go practice it, just to be safe you understand, nothing fun about that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LWesson Posted March 3, 2008 Share #20 Posted March 3, 2008 Hey Rick, I wanted to let you know I've had the mod installed for just over 2 weeks and it's already saved my bacon. This weekend I was on a back mountain road and came over a crest a little to hot, to find that the road dropped down at about a 20% grade and the road was very wet and super slick. It was overcast and cold so it may have been black ice. I bared touched the brake and still managed to lock it slightly even with the mod. I fishtailed but kept it upright. I did need a clean set of drawers though! I am 100% sure that if I did not have your mod installed, I probably would not have been able to recover from the fishtail. The rider behind me said he could read the venture logo on my saddlebag. Thanks for formalizing the mod. I have already recommended it to a handful of RSV / TD owners I'm in contact with. Once again, thanks for the mod and hard work. Cheers, Leonard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest longtrain59 Posted March 4, 2008 Share #21 Posted March 4, 2008 Thanks for getting that mod on the market Ricky. I've had my 99 since it was new. I came off a 87 VR and never had any brake issues. In 01 on a club ride in New Mexico, I had a friend do something dumb and I had to lock up the binders to keep from rear ending him. The bike low sided like it had a ton of weight on the left side. My point is, I have been through the safety courses and have put several hundred thousand miles on bikes. However, if you have to make a panic stop on a RS Venture, there is so much braking power on the rear wheel, the brake will lock and the bike will go down nearly everytime. After I had my accident in 01 I told Ricky there was something wrong with the braking system on the RS Venture. It shouldn't low side so easy. Ricky listened but didn't start investigating until it happened to him. My 99 was the first to get the mod and it is needed. I don't know why Yamaha couldn't have continued the braking system that was on the 1st generation. We never had these kinds of accidents from panic stops. All I can say to you naysayers out there is your time may be coming. Practice all you want to; but what happens when you have to stop now is not very pretty on this bike. In 01, I spent 6 hrs in OR for plastic surgery in a trama center in Las Cruces, New Mexico and then anopther 14 hrs of palstic surgery in Dallas a few monthes later. That stock rear brake will put your ass on the pavement berfore you can blink. Fix your rear brake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW47 Posted March 4, 2008 Share #22 Posted March 4, 2008 I have found a real cheap way to fix real wheel lockup when applying brakes to hard. Buy Bendix brakes pads MA 113, they are not nearly as strong as stock. You will have to try really hard to lock them up with thease pads. They are only about $17 a set at Advance auto parts. tew47 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1sttenor Posted March 6, 2008 Share #23 Posted March 6, 2008 Just a question.... Someone mentioned to me that there was a post on "another Venture site" about linking the brakes. What are the pros and cons of both???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KitCarson Posted March 7, 2008 Share #24 Posted March 7, 2008 I read all this new posting on Ricks Brake Mod. It is a good thing to have on your bike and may just one day save your butt. I keep hearing all this stuff about if you practice you will do what you practice. I will give you a little hint, I know where this statement comes from......it is in my new MSF instructors manual......word for word........and I totally dis-agree with it. I also dis-agree with the standard of having new riders make an emergency stop using the rear brake in the beginners classes....seems to me they are being taught.....kinda in the wrong way.....I am addressing this issue today...to use front and rear.....to stop and not slide the rear. Anyway I am a good one to actually go practice a bit usually about every other month or so......do not do it all the time......just occasionally unless I am playing with something like that TCB gadget and yep that is a gadget!! You can practice and practice.....it is all good......it does teach you to develop good skills.....teaches you to use the brakes as a team....more front but also modulate the rear......teaches you a lot of good skills. But in real life you do not always do what you practice.......you do not practice every day......you just ride.....yes you do tend to use the skills you have learned in practice under normal every day situations. But also bear in mind you do drive a car too.......and you use your big foot to stomp on the brakes.........I have always thought this has a bearing on what one does.....I can assure you you will not in an panic attack always do what you have practiced......things like this happen fast. You are scared, your heart is pumping adrenalin fast!! Sometimes time seems to go into slow motion.....I have not put a bike down in a long time.........but I have in the past..several times....and I was a whole lot faster and quicker then than I am now.......so.......what you will actually do is hit the rear brake too hard, with a little bit of time.....like Ricks Mod does give you.....you just might be able to get your brain to work and remember ......I need to modulate the rear brake......most will not.....they just hammer the brake....and down they go.......Best use whatever can help you and not hurt you . Kit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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