KiteSquid Posted May 22, 2009 Author Share #26 Posted May 22, 2009 That is Saber Cycles' ebay page. They also have an Internet store. URL is in the original post. Buy from whatever one has the lower price at your time of ordering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kandaje Posted May 22, 2009 Share #27 Posted May 22, 2009 Greetings... Let's talk accuracy for a second... If you are a race driver and milliseconds means something to you - then sure, accuracy might actually mean something to your paycheck... But if you are riding a 20+ year old machine (like a lot of us are) for fun or economics, and aren't overly anal retentive - Any difference in accuracy between syncing your carbs with a simple $3.50 oil column or a $100+ mercury filled High Tech gizmo - is going to dissapear the instant you come home from this weeks ride - That's reality - When you ride - your carbs go OUT of sync. It's called entropy. It's a law of the universe. The practical mind says that you'll use a tool that is handy, easy to use, and non-complicated. Simply put - if you aren't worried about screwing it up - and it works well enough to get you to use it again next week, then you will. My Bike is my only means of transportation. It's all I got, short of walking 3 miles to ride the bus. Keeping it running well, means that once a week or so, I pull out my $3.50 oil column and maybe burn my fingers on a hot engine. It takes all of 15 minutes. Maybe - one day, I might actually NEED to know just exacly how many Micro-Mega-pascals of sucktitude Cylinder #3 is actually drawing, and when that day comes - then sure, I might consider laying out the Obamabux for it. But until then - syncing my carbs using $3.50 worth of materials that takes all of 5 minutes to assemble, seems like a good idea to me. Especially in this economic day and age... Basicly all I'm saying is this - If you have NEVER done a carb sync on your bike yourself - You might be afraid, you might think you have no mechanical ability, whatever - then go spend $3.50 and do it. You will be amazed at the performance boost, and you'll feel really good about your mechanical abilities. You might even do that Tarzan thing and beat your chest with your fists afterwards - and you'll be justified in doing it... The VERY least of what you need: AT LEAST 30' of clear plastic hose that fits snugly over the vacumn nipples. From Lowes, Home Despot, Daves Mom's Hardware store - Drive your bike down, take a knife with you. Ask the High school dropout if you can test an inch of it for fit. The stuff is like 12 cents a foot. If he gives you a hard time - make fun of him. I say at LEAST 30 feet - because the more you use - the easier your life becomes, as we'll see. Don't scrimp here... A board or even a pipe about 4 feet long. 6 foot is even better. Any board will do, a wooden queen size bed slat works perfectly (that's 5 feet). Basicly anything that has 2 parrallel straight edges about 2 inches apart will work just fine. Some clear packing tape. Some 80w rear end gear oil. Any viscous liquid will work - but you really want to use something that you won't worry about if a little gets sucked into the engine. even Used engine oil will work too. You probably aren't so blind that you can't see yellowish 80w gear oil in the tube - so you really don't need to flavor it with something red for the coolness factor. I suggest the gear oil, because it works well in this particular recipe. Tape the Tube to the edges of the board so that you have the center of the tube at the bottom of the board and the tube running up both edges. Make a tape loop at the top so you can hang it on something. You should have 2 lengths of at least 10 feet of free tube coming off the top of the board. Fill the tube with enough gear oil so that it comes up at least half way or more up the board on both sides. The more oil you use - the slower the oil will move and the more time you have to play around with the screw before it gets sucked up too far IF your carbs are really out of sync. So YES - you can use too little oil, so again, don't be afraid to use enough. Try less or more - if you ARE overly anally retentive for MORE accuracy... Now it's time to say - that if you do this on a nice sunny hot day, and you build this thing in the sunshine - your life will be infinitely easier than if you do it on a cold frigid day. Warm oil, warm tube, etc... Get all the bubbles out. Hang it up in the sunshine, go make lunch. Do you need any markings on the board? No not really. But they look like you put more than a few seconds of thought into the construction, and it impresses your nosy next door neighbor who will definately stop cutting his grass and come over to see what you are doing and beg a beer. So go ahead and scribe a line at where the oil levels off with a ruler so he doesn't have anything to laugh at about you not being able to draw a straight line... But you DO want to mark one of the hose ends - Just Because. So grab a can of spray paint and shoot a little color on the end of one of the ends of the tube. Just so you always know which tube is which side of the board. Don't worry - this is just so you can always be sure - Cylinder #1 is drawing less or more - instead of having to constantly trace the line. I colored the right side line - but that's just the way I am. Your milage may differ... What you do: Take your bike for a ride down to the liquor store. This accomplishes 3 things; 1: It warms up the bike to operating temp. 2: Your begging nosy neighbor won't get your last beer. 3: You get reminded of how pathetic your bike was running before the sync. Take off the side covers of your bike. You now have a choice. You can also remove the fairing lowers and NOT burn your fingers, or you can leave them on and take the chance or wear gloves. If it's really hot outside - set up a big fan in front of your bike to keep it from overheating. Hang the board on the nearest fench or some other convienient location where you can see it - near the bike which is now on the center stand. Set Idle to just under 1000 rpm if it isn't already there. Pull the vacumn cap off cylinder #1 (left side rear) and the boost line off cylinder #2. Hook up the colored hose to cylinder 1 and the other one to #2. You can do it either way - but get in the habit of always doing it the same way every time. Get your screwdriver ready - and locate the sync screw. BTW - a set of small clamping pliars that can grab the screw - actually works better than a screwdriver here, but again, your milage may vary - You will be making very minute and precise movements - and I've had the clamping pliars "drop" just from gravity and screw me up. Life is full of choices... Pinch off BOTH tubes so that the oil won't move when you start the bike for the first time. Your Bike may be way out of sync, and you don't want it to injest all the oil instantly. Be prepared to hit the kill switch if you see the oil literally leap when you unpinch them. Now you can see why I said AT LEAST 30 feet of tube... Now we get back to accuracy. Basically - the only real world accuracy you really need here - is - Is the oil moving? Typically - if the cylinders are out of sync - the oil will move. Either up or down. You adjust the screw so that it stops moving. Then you turn off the engine - level the oil, and do it again. You do this as many times as you need until the oil doesn't move. You let the engine idle for a minute watching the oil - blip the throttle any time you make an adjustment - which are usually very tiny adjustments (which is why entropy makes pinpoint accuracy - pinpointless). Engine vibrations, heat, moving parts, metal fatigue, unequal expansion coefficients - all those things contribute to entropy and reduces any discusion of precision to an accademic excersise only. When you have #1 and #2 in sync - Turn off the motor. Replace the cap and the boost line and move to #3 and #4. Same procedure as #1 and #2. You use the rear of the two set screws to set #3 and #4. Now as you work your way around the cylinders - you may or may not have to readjust your idle speed as you go to keep it in the knat's hair range of just under 1000 rpm. So really you are accomplishing 2 things at once - syncing the carbs and getting your idle speed just right. Also - get into the habit of always replacing the cap or line on the nipples as soon as you remove the tube. Nipples should never see more than a minute of day light they might get sunburned! hehehe. Now you won't forget... When 3 and 4 are in sync - it's time to sync right side and left side - that's #4 and #2 and using the forward of the two set screws on the right side. Front Left #2 #4 right #1 #3 back Lather, rinse, repeat. The first time you do this - it might take you an hour. After that - If it takes you more than 15 minutes - Your neighbor is drinking way too many of your beers... Now, ride back down to the liquor store - and celebrate your mechanical genius by buying another 12 pack. Either you completely screwed the pooch and shouldn't be allowed within a mile of small children, or much more likely - You'll have a HUGE grin on your face and wonder why you didn't do this before... Don't drink and drive. It's too expensive... Do this once a week if you ride a lot. Once a month if you're a really lazy cheapskate like me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheradan Posted May 22, 2009 Share #28 Posted May 22, 2009 YES!!! Click on the photo of the four channel mercury manometer in my first post. Just ordered one. Didn't think they had these any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheradan Posted May 26, 2009 Share #29 Posted May 26, 2009 (edited) http://stores.shop.ebay.com/Saber-Cycle-Honda-Goldwing-Parts__W0QQ_armrsZ1QQ_fsubZ18266151 Here is the link to the ebay store. You will save about $15. than on there standard store link. Edited May 27, 2009 by Sheradan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheradan Posted May 27, 2009 Share #30 Posted May 27, 2009 They refused my first purchase because I had USPS marked for shipping and they cannot send Mercury through the mail. They rejected it because UPS was 90 cents more, and they could not recharge my card for it. 90 whole cents! It made me so mad I googled the part to see if there was another place to get it. Seems they are the only ones that have it, BUT I found there Ebay store. Ordered the exact same part from the Exact same place for $15 less. They should have just ponied up the 90 cents and sent the first order. What ever happened to customer service? I'm glad they are idiots, it saved me money. Just wish they hadn't wasted my time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted May 29, 2009 Share #31 Posted May 29, 2009 Just received mercury manometer from Sabre .Looks pretty good What are all the brass tubes and o rings and nuts used for?? I assume the little white plugs are the restricters. I have a 84 VR.I can see where storage would be a problem,Do you just hang it up in a safe place so it cant tip?? tia for any assistance JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share #32 Posted May 30, 2009 JWhat are all the brass tubes and o rings and nuts used for?? Vacuum Adapters for some bikes. I assume the little white plugs are the restricters. Correct I have a 84 VR.I can see where storage would be a problem,Do you just hang it up in a safe place so it cant tip?? That is what I do. but hang it high, so it is out of reach of children that my visit your garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted May 31, 2009 Share #33 Posted May 31, 2009 Thanks for your input ,also when syncing the carbs do you hang it off the bars and snake the hoses thru the frame???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeS Posted May 31, 2009 Share #34 Posted May 31, 2009 Park bike on center stand. Under an open garage door, works good. Hang the Mercury stiks from door center handle, works good. Keep the mercury tubes " vertical " You have to position the bike, so the hoses reach the carbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted June 1, 2009 Share #35 Posted June 1, 2009 Sounds like a winner thanks JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Star Ronnie Posted June 2, 2009 Share #36 Posted June 2, 2009 My Royal Star has no onboard rpm indicator. Anyone know of a cheap handheld tachometer I can buy to use while syncing my carbs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share #37 Posted June 2, 2009 When I think of cheap tools, Harbor-Freight is the first retailer that comes to my mind. They also sell some inexpensive tools too. Click HERE to see a multimeter with an inductive tachometer for $35. I think our bikes fire the plug twice in a cycle, so you might have to divide the reading by 2. There are others on the market. IIRC there is a thread about inexpensive tachometers here at THE forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Star Ronnie Posted June 2, 2009 Share #38 Posted June 2, 2009 Thanks to KiteSquid for the Harbor-Freight lead. **************************************************** HELP. I have a '98 standard Royal Star. My service manual lacks accurate instruction, and the carb drawings do not label the sync-ing screws. I carefully searched the underside of my carbs for the "sync"ing screws, and I found five brass slotted/philips adjusting screws. Are these the adjustment screws? I can see four of them from the left (choke-pull) side looking under the carbs and upward toward the right side; two are immediately under the left side carbs (#1 and #2) with one angled to the front and the other angled rearward, and the other two are straight across immediately next to each other between the right side (#3 and #4) carbs . And there is a fifth brass adjusting screw between the left side carbs, which can be seen when looking from the right side of the engine under the carbs. Which of the five do I adjust? The manual says #1 to #2, then #4 to #3, then #2 to #4 and quit! What if #3 is wrong to start with, and after adjusting #2 would it then be different than #1? And do I attach all four carbs to the manometer before doing any adjustments? Lastly, instead of "sync-ing", why not simply adjust each carb to a single optimal vacuum pressure at idle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skydoc_17 Posted June 2, 2009 Share #39 Posted June 2, 2009 Hey Ronnie, I am sorry to say that I can't help you as far as the Syncing screws on your second gen. But to answer your question about why not set the carbs. to a set vacuum here's the answer to that one. When you turn screw "A" you are actually BALLANCING the vacuum between Carb.#1 and #2. The same with screw "B", ballancing Carb. #3 to #4. Then when you turn screw "C" you ballance the right bank to the left bank. Thats why I made the remark about "Carb. Sync" not being the correct term. Hope this helps, Earl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Star Ronnie Posted June 3, 2009 Share #40 Posted June 3, 2009 Hey Ronnie, I am sorry to say that I can't help you as far as the Syncing screws on your second gen. But to answer your question about why not set the carbs. to a set vacuum here's the answer to that one. When you turn screw "A" you are actually BALLANCING the vacuum between Carb.#1 and #2. The same with screw "B", ballancing Carb. #3 to #4. Then when you turn screw "C" you ballance the right bank to the left bank. Thats why I made the remark about "Carb. Sync" not being the correct term. Hope this helps, Earl Ah yes. Now Kandaje's post #27 makes sense. Now then, anyone know exactly where my three sync-ing ('vacuum balancing') screws are located? '98 Royal Star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squeeze Posted June 3, 2009 Share #41 Posted June 3, 2009 just to add ... After you balanced the Vacuum in all four Intake Manifolds, your Throttle Plates will be operate synchronized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share #42 Posted June 3, 2009 You are synchronizing the cylinders by adjusting the carburetor linkages. You are adjusting the linkages to make the carburetors flow the same amount of air on each cylinder, so hopefully each cylinder will be making equal power no matter what the throttle setting is. Being as each cylinder has it's own carburetor, we need to synchronize them to make the engine as a unit operate at it's highest efficiency. If cylinder #1 is operating at 5 HP more than the remainder of the cylinders, you will get pulsations lower overall power output for fuel input and therefore lower HP and fuel economy. We are using definition #2 from http://www.therfreedictionary.com syn·chro·nize 1. To occur at the same time; be simultaneous. 2. To operate in unison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheradan Posted June 4, 2009 Share #43 Posted June 4, 2009 Just got my carb stick (manometer) from Saber. $46 shipped. Buy from there ebay store NOT the web site. Saved me $20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Star Ronnie Posted June 5, 2009 Share #44 Posted June 5, 2009 Just got my carb stick (manometer) from Saber. $46 shipped. Buy from there ebay store NOT the web site. Saved me $20. After seeing www.sabercyclesucks.com , I'll try Kandaje's "$3.50" manometer. No Paypal = red flag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Star Ronnie Posted June 6, 2009 Share #45 Posted June 6, 2009 $9.00 for 32' of tubing and $0.50 for 50ml gear oil. Worked perfectly! (Well, there was the $35 tachometer and the $5 10" #2 screwdriver.) http://hosting11.imagecross.com/image-hosting-01/2397Homemade-Manometer-3-.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted June 7, 2009 Author Share #46 Posted June 7, 2009 After seeing www.sabercyclesucks.com , I'll try Kandaje's "$3.50" manometer. No Paypal = red flag. I had no problem with the Mercury Manometer I bought from Saber Cycles. I wont be buying any gold wing parts from them, as I dont own a gold wing....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted June 8, 2009 Share #47 Posted June 8, 2009 I hooked up the mercury manometer and must be moisture in tubes ,as a couple of tubes have a separation of mercury. Did u come across this and does it effect the readings. I adjusted to accecptible level but curious as to whether the readings are accurate. There is about 1/8 to 1/4 gap in 2 tubes. tried tapping tubes ,turning motor off and restarting, still there ???? JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteSquid Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share #48 Posted June 9, 2009 What do you mean by a "separation of mercury"??? IF you are referring to different readings in the tubes, you have to synchronize your carbs to make them even. If you are saying there is a bubble of water in the mercury, I would have to see a photo. Each channel should have a solid column of mercury with no breaks. To make sure ANY manometer is reading right, which it should until the earth's gravity changes, you can hook all four tubes to the same vacuum source at the same time using some of the plastic fittings from the hardware store or auto parts store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted June 9, 2009 Share #49 Posted June 9, 2009 I would describe it as a bubble of water or a break in the solid column ____ ______ __ sort of like the line. 2 columns no breaks 2 columns look like the line . as far as the top of the mercury pretty much equal. just cant get the breaks out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb1016 Posted June 9, 2009 Share #50 Posted June 9, 2009 It was moisture in lines took tubes out of mercury and blew them out now solid line of mercury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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