Guest Swifty Posted December 18, 2012 Share #1 Posted December 18, 2012 (edited) Finally... I'm loving it. IMHO, this is NOT a "make-work" project; rather it is a "make-peace" project. A couple of things in the article I disagree with though... - loud pipes do NOT save lives, - a noise by-law should not only target motorcycles, it should target all vehicles that are unnecessarily loud, - and if a vehiclespasses a country's muffler code at the date of manufacture it should be allowed on the streets. Kudos to my City Councilors who had the courage to listen to the majority of the voters and pass this law by a good majority. Hopefully this will start a future of peaceful night's sleep for me and hundreds of thousands of residents who are so rudely kept awake by the selfish asinine actions of a few people. http://www.guelphmercury.com/news/local/article/855774--guelph-motorcycle-noise-bylaw-make-work-project-councillor-alleges (in case the link doesn't work, full text below)... Scott Tracey, Mercury staff Mon Dec 17 2012 Guelph motorcycle noise bylaw ‘make-work project,’ councillor alleges GUELPH — Motorcyclists hoping for an early Christmas present at city council Monday night might be feeling a bit Scrooged. Despite the concerns of two of their colleagues that noise restrictions on motorcyclists are unfair and “a make-work project,” the majority of city councillors approved a new testing protocol aimed at cracking down on loud bikes. Coun. Gloria Kovach noted the staff recommendation did not include options for targeting other loud vehicles “which arguably frequent our roadways more.” Kovach said she is also concerned about how the bylaw is to be enforced, noting only Guelph Police officers have the authority to pull over a suspected noise bylaw violator. But Kovach questioned whether listening to motorcycles’ exhaust notes is an effective use of the police service, which recently introduced an online reporting system for minor crime in an effort to be more efficient. The councillor suggested the bylaw will be a “bureaucratic nightmare” which unfairly targets motorcycles over other loud vehicles. Coun. Cam Guthrie said the legislation “pits neighbour against neighbour” by providing residents with another tool to use against each other. “I think this is a make-work project, and in fact I’m embarrassed I even referred this to staff in the first place,” Guthrie said. Several motorcyclists urged councillors to scrap the idea. Doak McCraney noted municipalities which have implemented similar restrictions are now facing legal challenges. He said the provincial Highway Traffic Act already regulates what is a legal exhaust system and provides officers tools to charge motorists who are unnecessarily making noise. Bill Kerr, who came to the podium in a black and orange Harley Davidson jacket, said despite a notation to the contrary in the staff report, “Loud pipes do save lives.” Kerr provided two examples of near-misses with cars, which he attributed to being able to rev his bike and make sufficient noise he got the drivers’ attention. Fellow enthusiast Mike Theriault told council he rides a 1947 motorcycle, which would likely not pass the new noise standard. He added it would be nearly impossible to equip his bike with parts to allow it to pass. “You can’t just go and find these parts,” Theriault said. “It’s going to fail and I know it’s going to fail. “If it came off the (assembly) line that way why should it not be allowed?” Doug Godfrey, the city’s manager of bylaw compliance and security, said officers will have some discretion in applying the law and would take the age of the vehicle into consideration. The bylaw passed 10-2, with Guthrie and Kovach voting against it. Edited December 18, 2012 by Swifty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3rider Posted December 18, 2012 Share #2 Posted December 18, 2012 oddly enough Buddy with the loud pipe probably be the first person to get upset when the neighbor is cutting his grass in the cool morning hrs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bongobobny Posted December 18, 2012 Share #3 Posted December 18, 2012 Swifty, for once I'm 100% in agreement with you!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Swifty Posted December 18, 2012 Share #4 Posted December 18, 2012 Swifty, for once I'm 100% in agreement with you!!! LOL, for once?...I'm sure we can find something else. Oh wait...you drive a 2nd gen...yeah, we probably won't, so let us revel in this one thing! LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Swifty Posted December 18, 2012 Share #5 Posted December 18, 2012 oddly enough Buddy with the loud pipe probably be the first person to get upset when the neighbor is cutting his grass in the cool morning hrs NO, I wouldn't. I stop hearing any lawnmower running in a neighbour's yard when it is approximately 4 or 5 houses distant from mine. However, I know for a fact I can hear motorcycles that are 3-4 miles away! The decibel reading of a properly muffled lawn mower comes nowhere near the decibel level of open pipe, improperly muffled bikes I hear, and so I'd be totally content with people mowing their lawns at ANY time of day OR night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted December 18, 2012 Share #6 Posted December 18, 2012 I like it. I sure wish they would pass and enforce that here. One reason that motorcycles are targeted is because the county buses and city trucks do not pass the noise ordinance. It is not just the Hardleys that are loud the high revving crotch rockets can also be heard for miles. then there's the cars with the loud fart pipes ........... none of which are bothered by the LEOs. I drive my car from the shop that put on the catalytic converter to the shop that was going to make a custom pipe to connect it to the exhaust and I got stopped, it was only 1.5 mile trip. Granted I may have been playing with the V8 and the open exhaust just a little. But still....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loehring Posted December 18, 2012 Share #7 Posted December 18, 2012 More power to you guys. Just another reason to live in the sunny south. I have loud pipes and I will disagree with you. Like the guy in the article I have had numerous situations in traffic in a major city like Atlanta where cars have stopped coming over on me because I reved the engine and they noticed me. Did it "save my life"? probably not but it did prevent a dicey situation that could have become ugly. Next thing you know they'll have everyone riding electric bikes and driving Nissan Leafs. Not in any way bashing our friends to the north. I grew up in London Ont. and there are many US cities that have taken the same route. Just disagree. Where I live there is no law regarding the db level but they will nail you if you're just reving for the hell of it on a diturbing the peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted December 18, 2012 Share #8 Posted December 18, 2012 There is no reason to piss off everyone all the time for those rare occasions when you need to let someone know you are there, that is what a horn is for, if you have time to rev the engine then you certainly have time to hit the horn button. I have yet to hear a single good reason to have loud pipes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 18, 2012 Share #9 Posted December 18, 2012 I have yet to hear a single good reason to have loud pipes. My reason, I like 'em I like drilled out RK's, can't stand to ride behind a Harley with screamin eagles. There is a HUGE difference between the two. forgot to add - loud is a relative term - the proper word should be decible level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted December 18, 2012 Share #10 Posted December 18, 2012 My reason, I like 'em I like drilled out RK's, can't stand to ride behind a Harley with screamin eagles. There is a HUGE difference between the two. forgot to add - loud is a relative term - the proper word should be decible level That is not a reason, it is an excuse. I have still not heard a good reason for loud pipes. There are a lot of things I would like to do but don't. Decibel level is how loud gets measured. The feds do have a decibel level that all new vehicles must meet. Even a Harley is quiet when it leaves the factory. If you make any mods to get louder (higher DB level) then you are doing something illegal and I hope that you would get a ticket for it. I just wish that more communities had the balls to enforce the current decibel laws, they are ignoring a potential cash generator. Around here you get an equipment violation for loud exhaust, you have 30 days to get it fixed or pay about a $150 fine for most it is cheaper to pay the fine than to get a new exhaust, and some just don't want to bother swapping exhaust back and forth if they still have a set of legal pipes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorcycle_1300 Posted December 18, 2012 Share #11 Posted December 18, 2012 I am not one with the wake babies and scare little old ladies crowd, but I am always concerned with the risk of incrementalism in ordinances. Little by little we are signing away our rights, while we try to limit the rights of others. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan Posted December 18, 2012 Share #12 Posted December 18, 2012 I will offer a slightly different perspective. On more than one occasion, the enjoyment of a good ride with fellow bikers has been wiped out by someone ahead of me with extra loud pipes. I think riders following behind someone with extra loud pipes are subjected to more noise than the biker with the loud pipes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGunn Posted December 18, 2012 Share #13 Posted December 18, 2012 My reason, I like 'em I like drilled out RK's, can't stand to ride behind a Harley with screamin eagles. There is a HUGE difference between the two. forgot to add - loud is a relative term - the proper word should be decibel level I mounted a set of these eagles on my bike (RSV) and went for a 3 hour ride on the highway only. When I got home I took them off put them back in the box they came in put the RKs back on and have been quite happy with the quiet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arejay Posted December 19, 2012 Share #14 Posted December 19, 2012 A similar by-law was passed in Calgary. Just wondering how loud is determined elsewhere. The Calgary by-law is anything over 92 decibel. Similar to photo radar cameras a camera "noise trap" is used and the offender gets the ticket in the mail. I am running RK's as well and have no worries about ever getting a ticket. Visibility is safety. "Loud pipes save lives"..... you can hear those loud bikes long before you see them. Is my bike now safer because it is louder? My opinion is no My bike is safer because I ride safe always..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dynodon Posted December 19, 2012 Share #15 Posted December 19, 2012 A few years ago I was at an outdoor seating area at a restaurant in a suburb of Detroit. Sitting just a few feet from a busy street. just down the street, a block away was a biker bar. Bikes of all sorts were coming by, choppers, old Harley, new Glides, cruisers etc, and the occasional metric. Funny thing was that none of our conversations were disturbed in the least. ALL the bikes, including the custom job with ape hangers were quiet as a stock glide. That city must have had one heck of a noise ordinance. All of us there loved that the people seemed to be having just as much fun on their bikes, and the rest of us could carry on a conversation. Loud pipes can KILL if you are surprised by the rap of a really loud bike. I have been distracted big time by some jerk rapping his super loud pipes. NO way you can tell where the noise is coming from. I have pretty good control in those situations, but I saw other cars zig and zag at random, all because this jerk at a stop sign was having fun rapping his Harley. I live in a mostly quiet town on the south edge. I know all the roads in the area. One night with the windows open, I heard a loud Harley coming from near the river (that is over 6 miles away), heard him come into town, go to each stop light and around the city square and knew he was coming past my house. I live about 400 feet off the road, down and surrounded by trees, usually I can't hear any highway noise if it isn't pretty loud. I heard windows in my house rattle as this bike came by (did I mention it was after midnight?) Then I heard him take a typical country road with a few curves, and I heard him take every curve, every shift and every mile till he got on the interstate almost 8 miles away. Yes, that far. This was the loudest thing I have ever heard other than a top fuel dragster. And he was milking it (cracking the throttle so he accelerated like a lot of Harley riders do when they hit that noisy sweet spot) for all it was worth. Amazing. I would rather hear the music in my headsets than my pipes on my Wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradT Posted December 19, 2012 Share #16 Posted December 19, 2012 Firstly I do not like loud pipes, but then what is loud. The problem is what they believe is loud and how the testing is performed which bugs me even more. Crotch rockets screaming and a loud Diesel in full throttle can be much louder than most bikes with straight pipes. Bigger problem is the one ahole with loud pipes on a residental street who thinks its cool. Did not read the article and not worth the reading same ole one sided comments. Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 19, 2012 Share #17 Posted December 19, 2012 That is not a reason, it is an excuse. I have still not heard a good reason for loud pipes. There are a lot of things I would like to do but don't. Decibel level is how loud gets measured. The feds do have a decibel level that all new vehicles must meet. Even a Harley is quiet when it leaves the factory. If you make any mods to get louder (higher DB level) then you are doing something illegal and I hope that you would get a ticket for it. I just wish that more communities had the balls to enforce the current decibel laws, they are ignoring a potential cash generator. Around here you get an equipment violation for loud exhaust, you have 30 days to get it fixed or pay about a $150 fine for most it is cheaper to pay the fine than to get a new exhaust, and some just don't want to bother swapping exhaust back and forth if they still have a set of legal pipes. I respectfully dis-agree, that is a reason, I don't need excuses for anything I do. What is the decible level number in your city ? what is the decible reading of your model airplanes ? I would bet that my Venture's decible reading with RK's on it is lower that some of the rc planes at your club and wishing somebody monetary loss is really adult, congratulations on your step up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Swifty Posted December 21, 2012 Share #18 Posted December 21, 2012 they published it... http://www.guelphmercury.com/opinion/letters/article/856452--motorcycle-noise-bylaw-a-peaceful-solution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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