Stitch65 Posted July 28, 2011 Share #1 Posted July 28, 2011 Heya, New to the site and "kinda" new to the Venture... to the point, I have had this bike for about 5 mos now and am about to replace the rt. fork seal for the 3rd (that's right) 3rd time! I have had the fork out and on the bench at the shop twice to look for anything that could be causing this issue. No scratches (beyond normal wear), rock chips, gouges, etc. etc. This fork had been gotten into before I bought it and a little messed up on reassembly, in as much as they put that little aluminum sleeve w/ the collar on the metering tube inside the fork back in upside down. It was jammed on there pretty hard so I got it off and cleaned it up w/ some emery and polished it with a dremmel best I could. Functionality seems pretty good other than this darn seal. There were these two brass colored rings (I would call them bushings for lack of an automotive equivalent) that looked a bit worn but still reassembled nicely snug. That is about all I can think of as far as info/history on this... please tell me someone has encountered this problem or similar, this little repair is getting annoying... I want to ride w/o the worry of this seal just puking all over the brake caliper. Thanks in advance for ANY suggestions! Oh yea... '86 VR / XVZ1300, 87K miles Side note... I read a post that said the oil should only be half way up the sight glass, is this accurate? Another suggested using 15W-40 for my climate here in CO. is that accurate? I'm thinking I have some reading and serious part shopping to do here! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skydoc_17 Posted July 28, 2011 Share #2 Posted July 28, 2011 Hey Kelly, Welcome to the forum! Lots of combined knowledge here. My dad always told me, "No such thing as a stupid question, only stupid mistakes made for not having the courage to ask"! The front forks are an area where you have constant movement, and wear on these parts is almost undetectable with the naked eye. I also don't skimp in the purchase of the fork seals and buy the Genuine Yamaha parts here. Other tricks I have used in the past would be to purchase another fork tube assembly from a lower mileage VR, going to 15 wt. fork oil, and lastly, adding 1 once of Lucas Power Steering Stop Leak per fork tube. You of course will have to determine which one of these "fixes" fit your pocketbook and how "warm and fuzzy" you feel about the repair. As far as the oil level, half way up the sight glass is the Cardinal Rule. Any higher and the Air Box ends up filling with oil or the rear seal will leak. I live in South Central Pa., ride mostly in the summer months, (and it has been a HOT one this year!) I run the 20W50 Castrol GTX "Red Cap" (NO Friction Modifiers because of the wet clutch) Many run the Synthetic, here again, your choice, your money. You have a fair amount of miles on that motor, but these motors regularly go upwards of 200,000 miles with no major work with regular oil changes. I admire the fact that you have taken a run at this fork seal three times, but if it were me, I would consider another fork tube assembly, (first choice) or break out the micrometers and figure out which parts are out of spec. Continue to ask questions, post often, and try to get out and meet a few of your brother VentureRiders in the area. Good luck with this project, Earl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuzzyRSTD Posted July 28, 2011 Share #3 Posted July 28, 2011 Sorry Kelly, I can not help here. But as Skydoc says, I admire your grit and hanging in there. Welcome to the site, and there are no stupid questions here. I know because I have gotten myself into a few things, and then found out that I really did not know as much as I thought I did. You came to the right place here, there are a lot of very knowledgeable bike mechanics here, and they do not care to go out of their way and beyond to help. It might take them a little time to get back to you on some more thought if it has not already been taken care of. So many are out riding and doing their thing right now. Sounds like Skydoc has already helped. Again, welcome......... Oh ya, there is at least one rule here we have. We love to see pictures with questions/modifications/how to/ and just about anything. Fuzzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted July 28, 2011 Share #4 Posted July 28, 2011 One important thing to do when replacing the seals is to tape over the ciriclip cutout on the fork tube, if you don't do this, you can or will put a small gouge in the seal,,, every-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch65 Posted August 4, 2011 Author Share #5 Posted August 4, 2011 Been too long coming but THANK YOU! Skydoc, Fuzzy & Marcarl... Yamaha parts being ordered... seals (oil seals, dust seals, & guide bushings). Got some 15wt and stop leak from work so when the parts get here we'll spend a couple hours knockin these things out again and hopefully for the last time. One question about the advice received from Marcarl... I remember this job well and there are actually 2 circlips encountered. One is directly below the air suspension collar on the inner tube, and the other is obviously the retaining clip on top of the flat washer that sits on the oil seal and clips to the outer tube. I should know this already but which one should I watch out for? I can tape both if necessary I guess, just more for my own knowledge than anything. Skydoc... I have to admit I was a bit skeptical on the whole "half glass" thing as far as the oil was concerned, being a tech by trade it goes against all that I know to run low oil especially as hard as I work this thing in the mountains sometimes. But upon dissasembly to perform some other stupid little tasks I decided to take a looksee at the air box and I'LL BE DANGED! puddle of oil, and on the down draft boots outside! (but just the rear 2) so I drained it down tonight and I'll be a little more trusting in the future... Haven't found any "red cap" 20W-50 around here yet, most of the mainstream auto parts stores are worthless when it comes to variety or off the norm products. We have an average temp around here of about 70 but it's much colder during much of the season especially in the mornings so I hope 20-50 will be cool for the colder temps. Anyway... thanks again, you guys rock! BTW... as soon as I figure out how to post some pics here I will take apart my modified CLASS unit and post how to convert it to manual operation (at least how I did it) using the existing circuit board, harness, box etc. someone might get some use out of that cause it's a little different than the fixes I have read on here so far. The Samurai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twigg Posted August 4, 2011 Share #6 Posted August 4, 2011 CLASS is a bit of a gimmick. It works but there are better solutions. Progressive springs in the front forks with about one inch of pre-load, and a rear shock rebuild with a Progressive spring, or go the whole hog and replace the mono-shock. You shouldn't really need the CLASS after that. What I have noticed is that with the bike loaded and my 150lb wife on the back, 43lbs of air, which is the medium setting, is about perfect .... nothing in the front. My set up is Progressives in the front which are in spec, and the original, and probably a bit tired shock on the back. I set it on #3. I'm guessing that a new shock would let me forget about the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted August 4, 2011 Share #7 Posted August 4, 2011 Progressive springs in the front forks with about one inch of pre-load, . Could someone explain what is meant by one inch of pre-load and how you attain it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted August 4, 2011 Share #8 Posted August 4, 2011 Could someone explain what is meant by one inch of pre-load and how you attain it? Preload means that when the fork is fully extended, ie front wheel off the ground, that the spring is compressed 1 inch from the length it would be if it was not installed and just laying on the floor. To get the 1 inch of preload you put a 1 inch spacer on the top of the spring so that by the time you get the caps back on the spacer has the spring already compressed by 1 inch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twigg Posted August 4, 2011 Share #9 Posted August 4, 2011 Preload means that when the fork is fully extended, ie front wheel off the ground, that the spring is compressed 1 inch from the length it would be if it was not installed and just laying on the floor. To get the 1 inch of preload you put a 1 inch spacer on the top of the spring so that by the time you get the caps back on the spacer has the spring already compressed by 1 inch. And the spacer is just a piece of white plastic pipe usually .... If the spring kit doesn't include any, Lowes and Homedepot has plenty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venturous Randy Posted August 5, 2011 Share #10 Posted August 5, 2011 When I put Progressive springs in my 83, I used zero preload spacers. On mine, the springs were about even with the top of the tubes and had to be compressed slightly to screw the caps in. I run zero air in the front and so far all my bottoming out has been eliminated. It still raised the bike some in the front and I would not want it any taller. I also found that clear scotch tape worked good on the ring grooves to not chip the seals. RandyA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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