Turn Signal Problem

[DesertRider]

The past couple of days my turn signals would sometimes work when the button was pushed left or right, other times it wouldn't work but if I toyed with the switch a few times they usually would work. Today riding home from work, they wouldn't work and nothing I did could get either one to flash. When I got home, I killed the engine with the kill switch and with the ignition switch still on. When the motor stopped running, I could hear a light buzzing noise somewhere near the front of the bike - at first I thought the fan might be running but it wasn't. It took me a minute to figure out that it's related to the turn signals. When I push down on the turn-signal switch or move it to center, the buzzing stops. When I push it left or right for one of the turn signals, the buzzing starts again but no turn signal. Slice the button the other way a little and the buzzing stops again. I guess it's more like a fast repeating click than a buzz. What could be causing the noise and the turn signal problem ?

[camos]

Switch stuck, bad contacts or both. Its been a bit damp here and a few days ago the right turn signal on my bike tuned on sometimes or not or would flash a short while before turning off. After spraying with WD40 it's been working fine. Perhaps that is all that's necessary to deal with your problem.

[paysaw]

This could be a long shot, but your turn signals are connected through your 4 way flashers.Check and see if your 4 ways works.It could be in your 4 way switch.Try cleaning that switch too.

[Trader]

could the buzzing be the flasher relay gone bad?

[bongobobny]

That's what I'm thinking...

 

Try to pinpoint where the buzzing is coming from. If it is above the headlight then it is the flasher as it is located on the front fairing frame.

[bkuhr]

That's what I'm thinking...

 

Try to pinpoint where the buzzing is coming from. If it is above the headlight then it is the flasher as it is located on the front fairing frame.

 

I believe on my 83, turn and 4-way flashers are on forward left frame, (maybe accessable-?- thru left turn signal housing) on the fairing frame under the left cowling simular location of reserve light relay on right side

[DesertRider]

Thanks for all the replies everybody. Today the left one worked but not the right. The night before this started we had a hard rain and the bike was uncovered so maybe it's moisture related or dirty contact points. I'll try the WD40 first and see if that helps or not.

 

Mike

[DesertRider]

OK, getting back to my flasher problem. I opened up the top-left fairing and traced the buzzing noise to my flasher. I took the flasher out and rapped it a couple of times on my bench top and plugged it back in. It worked fine for about a minute then started buzzing again. Went to AutoZone and bought a heavy duty automotive flahser (Blazer FL36) plugged it in and nothing - no blink, no click no buzz, nothing. Plugged my old one back in and it still works occasionally but mostly just buzzes. Is there an automotive type flasher that will work in this thing ? I haven't looked at the partshark yet. I was thinking since it's just a flasher the may be an automotive type that will work. Here's a picture of the flasher. The emergency flasher work just fine but they are on a different flasher, a round type.

 

Ouch ! Just looked on partshark. If I'm looking right, the flasher is $91 there. Hope there are other options but I guess there is always old-fashioned hand signals.

FLASHER RELAY ASSY

2NV-83350-00-00 (replaces 4E6-83350-70-00) $91.57

Edited September 26, 2010 by DesertRider
added picture of flahser

[DesertRider]

Read up on a few more past threads on this same problem and did a little more trouble shooting. I have about 12 volts at the brown wire lead into the flasher and about 12.4 at the 4-way switch where the juice come from. Cleaned the contacts and checked voltage and continuity on the 4-way and that all looks good. I also ran a temporary 12 volt lead directly from the battery to the flash lead (shows 12.4 at the flasher) but still the flasher works intermittently and mostly just buzzes. I tried a couple more automotive flashers, an old one I already had and a new one from NAPA and the flashers do nothing, no flash, no click, no buzz, nothing with an automotive flasher. I am almost convinced that my flasher is bad. Is there anything else I should check ? If not I'm going to button this puppy up and start looking for another flasher.

[bkuhr]

Not sure if our flashers are load dependant like old car fashers, Have you converted to low load LEDs, or check for burned out bulb. Just suggestion.

[GeorgeS]

Not sure if our flashers are load dependant like old car fashers, Have you converted to low load LEDs, or check for burned out bulb. Just suggestion.

If you have LED bulbs in the flasther, go back to stock bulbs !!!

[hipshot]

just a thought.

the old flasher unit says 12.8V.

at 12.4 you may not be getting enough power to open and close the breaker points inside the flasher, hence the "buzzing" sound.

i could be wrong, but i would run it straight from the battery, just to check it.

just jt

[DesertRider]

Thanks everybody. I am running stock lights, no LED's. No burned out bulbs. I also tried running it directly from the battery. Even with the engine running and the ampmeter showing about 14 volts all it wanted to do was buzz. I just found a full set of used flashers and other relays off of another 83 venture for $24 so I bought them. I've buttoned it up for now and will try the other flasher when I get it.

 

Since buttoning it up, now my neutral safety switch isn't working - that is to say that now it will start in gear without the clutch pulled in - what in the world could I have pulled loose when I was messing with that flasher relay ?

[GeorgeS]

The switch for the Shift ind. is located under the rear left case cover.

 

5 position switch, it throws a ground, to the CMU, for the Position indicator.

 

About only thing can go wrong with that, is the switch itself. Each contact has a seperate wire going up to the CMU.

 

There is an In-Line Plug, between the switch and CMU. find that, and clean plug before you pull off the rear case cover.

 

The switch can most likley be repaired with a Dab of solder on each of the contacts.

 

Most likley you will need a new gasket for the case cover, before replaceing it.

 

If you pull it off, another job to do , while in there is to replace the Clutch Slave Cylinder, if its never been replaced. Kill 2 birds with one stone as they say.

[bkuhr]

Try flasher with cancel relay disconnected-per manual.

[DesertRider]

Thanks George. I was thinking it might be a switch on the clutch lever but I probably didn't clarify it very well, sorry. Neutral light works. When it's in gear (neutral light off) the bike will crank with the clutch lever fully extended. I used to have to pull the clutch lever all the way in if it's in gear before it would crank.

 

bkuhr

where do I disconnect the turn signal cancel ? Can I just bend one of the prongs out on my automotive flasher so only 2 prongs connect ? which one ?

 

Thanks

Edited September 27, 2010 by DesertRider

[bkuhr]

Flasher cancel relay under right hand faring with 5 wires and flat 6 pin plug, maybe?accessable thru right turn signal?

[DesertRider]

my ebay brown bag of 83' flashers, switches and relays came in today. The "new" flasher relay works the same as my old one. Looked for the flasher cancel again in the right fairing but it isn't there. I'll pull the headlight and instrument cluster out this weekend, it has to be under there somewhere. I think the flasher-cancel must be the relay in the top-right of the picture.

[bkuhr]

I think the flasher-cancel must be the relay in the top-right of the picture.

 

Yep, thats it

 

Looked for the flasher cancel again in the right fairing but it isn't there. I'll pull the headlight and instrument cluster out this weekend, it has to be under there somewhere. .

 

Thru right hand turn signal way down low, two relays-bottom turn cancel(pointer and X on mine), maybe need to get to connector thru headlight though. Hard to get pic.

[greg_in_london]

Well my initial thought was that you have a short-circuit in the wiring somehwere between the flasher/switch and the bulb. I don't know why it affects both left and right, unless you have a short in the switch itself, but most switch relays work on heating up with about 4 amps going through them (45-50W) until they click off, then cooling down until it switches on again.

If you get a short, the current is much higher and it heats up more quickly. On some relays it will cycle so quickly that it sounds like a buzz click-click-click-click etc.

Normally it would only affect the side with the short though.

 

If you by-passed the relay then if that was the problem, the lights would come on and stay on. Unless there is something in the flasher cancelling system that complicates things. If the fuse doesn't blow, then you're back to replacing the relay.

 

$91 for a relay ? I know sometimes they try and charge more, bit >OUCH

[DesertRider]

thanks Greg. I got another flasher relay in my ebay grab bag and I tried it and it does the exact same thing as my old one. I also got around to running new a wire from the 4-way flasher switch-power out wire (when off) to the flasher relay in (brown wire) - made no difference. Before I buttoned it up last night, I pulled the seat, trunk, wire-cover under the trunk, and side covers off and unplugged, cleaned and lubed every connector to everything on the bike that I could get to, including the turn-signal circuit all the way to the tail signals - made no difference. I think I'm stuck finding and unplugging the flash cancel relay, and since I have another cancel relay now, try it first before leaving it unplugged. Still hoping that will work. I also now have a spare 4-way flasher relay (2-prong type, the round one). I might try that in turn signal flasher plug once I get the cancel-relay located and unplugged. After 27 years about half of the connectors were incredibly cruddy and half were incredibly clean inside. Hope I get it soon - taking that fairing apart too often is kind of hard on some of those old plastic screw joints.

[DesertRider]

I finally got around to unplugging the turn-signal canceller - it is in the very bottom of the right top fairing cover, I had to pull the headlight out to unplug it. Short story is that unplugging the canceller and using a 2-prong flasher relay made no difference whatever except the two prong flasher doesn't buzz when the flasher doesn't work. I opened up my turn signal switch and cleaned it with contact cleaner again and now, the right-signal works every time, but the left one either does nothing or works - most of the time nothing, but occasionally works, maybe 1 out of 5 times it will work. With that little bit of difference, I plugged the canceller back in, and put my original flasher back in and the right signal still works every time, and the left either works or the original flasher relay buzzes - usually just buzzes and no flash. Anyway, now I am thinking that my turn-signal switch on the handle bar is bad, or maybe the wiring harness to it has a problem, but atleast I now have a right signal.

[DesertRider]

I picked up a switch & housing (turn / hi-low / horn ) with the wiring harness on ebay, finally got it today. Disconnected my turn-hi_low-horn wiring harness plugs behind the headlight and hooked up the new ebay one. The ebay one works exactly the same as mine - right flashers work good, and left flashers do not work. Removed the ebay switch and Re-connected my original.

 

Since the 4-way flasher works and all 4 lights flash, can I assume that the extended wiring to each flasher light is good ?

 

I'm thinking about wiring in a new seperate switch & flasher relay.

[bkuhr]

Suspect defective bulb with too low of resistance

 

Easy check, with 4 way on is a bulb brighter than rest?

4 way circuit uses all parts of turn circuit except turn switch. Also a ground in turn switch could cause problem, but you likely ruled out with another turn switch. Could put jumper in turn switch connector from brown/white to chocolate(power from flasher to left turn) to 100% rule out switch

 

Hard check, pull 3 wire flasher and check resistance from brown/white wire to battery ground. Key off, flasher switch first to right, then left

 

I expect readings as follows

1156 tail bulb=12.8V,2.1A,26.8W,6.09ohm

1157 front turn bulb(bright element)12.8V,26.9W,2.1A,6.09ohm (turn)

(dim element) 12.8V,8.3W,.648A,19.7ohm (marker)

Unsure dash bulb estimate same as 1157 dim @19.7 ohm

So 2ea 6.09ohm and 1ea 19.7ohm bulbs in parallel=about 2.6ohms circuit resistance

1/(1/r1+1/r2+1/r3.....)

 

Expect working right to show about 2.6 ohms, and defective left to show something less.

Then start pulling the left/dash bulbs until you find the one causing trouble.

 

[DesertRider]

Thanks again bkuhr. I'll check the bulbs this morning. For some reason I suspect the left-rear turn signal. The reason is that a while back I had to pull the gas tank out for fix a petcock leak. When I put it back in, I had no left signal. I pulled the seat off and found the ground wire to the left-rear signal unplugged. Plugged it in and it started working but a couple of days later, the problem I have now surfaced - I can't help but think that the two signal problems are related. I have since pulled the seat and went over that rear signal wiring pretty thoroughly but I didn't consider a weak bulb.