Plugged the AIS yesterday - - with a wire nut!

[Bobby G]

Didn't have anything quite wide enough to plug the AIS, so I got the biggest tapered wire nut I had in the workshop, wrapped the outside of it a few times with duct tape to make it snug in the hole, and then duct taped over the plug after insertion before reattaching the hose. Works like a charm! Didn't do the front AIS yet, but I'll use the same thing when I do my next oil and filter change and can get to it easier.

 

Go me!

[Carbon_One]

Oh great now we're resorting to duct tapping the bikes together??

Did I say I hate duct tape on anything mechanical?

As a retired mechanic I hate to see people using duct tape on any vehicle, be it car truck or bike. Maybe in a pinch as a temporary fix but that would be the limit.

That stuff never lastes long in the elements and then leaves nothing but a sticky mess when it will eventually fail.

Did I say I hate duct tape on anything but duct work?

Sorry for venting but this is a pet peave of mine.

Larry

[tpalshadow]

Sorry for venting but this is a pet peave of mine.

 

Favorite part of your whole post!

[Bobby G]

That stuff never lastes long in the elements and then leaves nothing but a sticky mess when it will eventually fail.

 

Good thing the duct tape is on the INSIDE of the tube!!!

 

Did I mention that I had the bike up on my Carbon_One lift adapter when I did this???

 

(Sorry Larry, I couldn't resist!)

 

LOL!!!!

[V7Goose]

Oh great now we're resorting to duct tapping the bikes together??

Did I say I hate duct tape on anything mechanical?

As a retired mechanic I hate to see people using duct tape on any vehicle, be it car truck or bike. Maybe in a pinch as a temporary fix but that would be the limit.

That stuff never lastes long in the elements and then leaves nothing but a sticky mess when it will eventually fail.

Did I say I hate duct tape on anything but duct work?

Sorry for venting but this is a pet peave of mine.

Larry

Larry, I COMPLETELY agree with you - everything you said is so absolutely true. Oh, well, not everything - Duct tape is the absolutely worst thing to ever use on duct work!

 

But ya know, some jobs just DESERVE duct tape and all the bad things that come from it. And this job was one of them.

Goose

[Red Rider]

Whats the AIS and why are you pluging it?

[Dave77459]

But ya know, some jobs just DESERVE duct tape and all the bad things that come from it. And this job was one of them.

Knowing your not-quite-secret feelings about AIS plugging, this made me laugh!

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

[Bummer]

...

Did I say I hate duct tape on anything but duct work?

...

 

Larry, I COMPLETELY agree with you - everything you said is so absolutely true. Oh, well, not everything - Duct tape is the absolutely worst thing to ever use on duct work!

 

Just as a totally useless FYI, technically it's not really "duct" tape. The original was made for the Navy for use on boats. It was called "Duck" tape. The whole point was a strong, waterproof tape, for emergency repairs in a marine environment. There was also a strong assumption that the vessel would not survive to need proper repairs. The idea was to get the men in the boat to shore before the boat sank with the tape still attached.

 

It was never intended for use on duct work.

 

Not disagreeing with you guys at all. It's just that I saw a "bug show" that told the history of the stuff.

 

But ya know, some jobs just DESERVE duct tape and all the bad things that come from it. And this job was one of them.

Goose

 

Seems likely a carb sync would have been more appropriate. But that might just be me.

[V7Goose]

Seems likely a carb sync would have been more appropriate. But that might just be me.

We can only guess what the real issue was, but since the messenger just got shot, we'll probably never know.

 

The AIS is kinda like a wife who works hard at cleaning the bathroom, but when she notices the toilet leaking, she constantly tells you it needs to be fixed. Some guys just don't care that there is something broke, they just want the wife to shut up! By killing the wife, they never have to be bothered again by a reminder that it is broken, but the cleaning stops too.

Goose

Edited June 22, 2010 by V7Goose

[Carbon_One]

We can only guess what the real issue was, but since the messenger just got shot, we'll probably never know.

 

The AIS is kinda like a wife who works hard at cleaning the bathroom, but when she notices the toilet leaking, she constantly tells you it needs to be fixed. Some guys just don't care that there is something broke, they just want the wife to shut up! By killing the wife, they never have to be bothered again by a reminder that it is broken, but the cleaning stops too.

Goose

LMAO now with some of the posts.

I used to work in a shop ( golf course equipment) where one guy seemed to grab duct tape for just about any reason. Then later when it had to be fixed guess who got the job of cleaning the mess and doing a proper repair. Most times if he'd of just taken a few minutes longer he could of fixed it right to begin with.

It got bad enough I actually swiped his roll of tape and hid it. Now that was funny, him looking high and low for the roll of tape.

Larry

[Carbon_One]

Knowing your not-quite-secret feelings about AIS plugging, this made me laugh!

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

 

Ya me too Dave

[Jerry W]

We can only guess what the real issue was, but since the messenger just got shot, we'll probably never know.

 

The AIS is kinda like a wife who works hard at cleaning the bathroom, but when she notices the toilet leaking, she constantly tells you it needs to be fixed. Some guys just don't care that there is something broke, they just want the wife to shut up! By killing the wife, they never have to be bothered again by a reminder that it is broken, but the cleaning stops too.

Goose

 

OR, they have done all they have the skills and know how to do and are trying to get the noise to stop. Things like that happen ya' know.

[Seaking]

LOL.. if ANY job deserves duct tape, plugging the AIS is one of them... Nice line! lol And I know where you went with that one

 

As Red Green said "If the ladies don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy".. the man with the duct tape..

[dfitzbiz]

Whats the AIS and why are you pluging it?

 

Good question Red Rider. I would like to know the same.

[flb_78]

the AIS is an Air Injection System.

 

It passively injects fresh air into the exhaust to burn off unburned hydrocarbons (gasoline) to make Al Gore happy.

 

As a result, there is often a popping noise in the exhaust from the carbs not being tuned exactly perfect.

 

Instead of retuning the carbs, many plug the AIS so the unburned hydrocarbons just vent to atmosphere through the exhaust, which makes Al Gore sad.

[dfitzbiz]

I don't have a popping sound in my exhaust but I might plug my AIS just to make poor AlGore sad.

[V7Goose]

the AIS is an Air Injection System.

 

It passively injects fresh air into the exhaust to burn off unburned hydrocarbons (gasoline) to make Al Gore happy.

 

As a result, there is often a popping noise in the exhaust from the carbs not being tuned exactly perfect.

 

Instead of retuning the carbs, many plug the AIS so the unburned hydrocarbons just vent to atmosphere through the exhaust, which makes Al Gore sad.

Now ya see, that's not too bad for a three line summation, but not completely accurate. The reality is that carb tuning is not very critical to this bike in preventing afterfire. Carb SYNC is fairly important, but carb sync is also very important to a smooth running engine with appropriate power and lack of vibration. But the carb sync hasta be pretty bad before it will cause afterfire unless it is coupled with another problem. In preventing the popping/banging on deceleration, things that cause an afterfire are much more often vacuum leaks, old plugs, bad connection in the plug caps (high resistance), and exhaust leaks.

 

None of those are good things, and I just take the minority opinion that I actually want to KNOW if one of them is wrong on my bike and FIX it. These bikes do not have afterfire if there is not something wrong.

 

I don't have a popping sound in my exhaust but I might plug my AIS just to make poor AlGore sad.

Ya know, I never thought about it like that, but that might be a very good reason to plug the AIS! Now if we could just figure out a way to piss off Al Gore without unnecessarily adding to our air pollution, I'd be on that in a second!

Goose

Edited June 23, 2010 by V7Goose

[dfitzbiz]

I guess it's to late to fool around with Al's wife, she already dumped him. Maybe he has a girlfriend..................

[Bobby G]

I am SOOOO glad I started this thread!!! This is just too damn funny to be taken seriously.......

 

Oh, I forgot to mention that I did the front AIS last night, but instead of using "duck" tape (thanks for that clarification!), I used black Gorilla Tape to wrap the wire nut to get the proper diameter fit for the AIS opening, and then clamped the hose back over the whole shabang. Same great result, and no shaBANG!

 

Why don't I have this much fun working on and talking about my wife's Harley???

[1joeranger]

So V7Goose, I have always been rather ambivalent when it comes to the AIS system. It is sort of like the state of Louisiana, everyone knows it is there but nobody really cares! (Sorry Boomer!). I assume most have removed theirs because of backfiring? If I followed this correctly your position is that the AIS is the symptom not the cause? So what would be the procedure to find the culprit? Maybe if we had a checklist of items to investigate, ie

 

1st check for vacuum leaks (what is the procedure for that)

2nd replace old plugs

3rd check for bad connection in the plug caps (high resistance)

4th look for exhaust leaks.

 

A good write up with pictures would be a great alternative choice and may keep others from such radical surgery, as that of removing the AIS! Just a thought!

[V7Goose]

So V7Goose, I have always been rather ambivalent when it comes to the AIS system. It is sort of like the state of Louisiana, everyone knows it is there but nobody really cares! (Sorry Boomer!). I assume most have removed theirs because of backfiring? If I followed this correctly your position is that the AIS is the symptom not the cause? So what would be the procedure to find the culprit? Maybe if we had a checklist of items to investigate, ie

 

1st check for vacuum leaks (what is the procedure for that)

2nd replace old plugs

3rd check for bad connection in the plug caps (high resistance)

4th look for exhaust leaks.

 

A good write up with pictures would be a great alternative choice and may keep others from such radical surgery, as that of removing the AIS! Just a thought!

Well, I HAVE written about this issue in exhaustive and minute detail in many older threads - so much so that many of the long-time members here are sick of hearing about it. I actually try real hard to not get involved in new threads about the AIS, but sometimes I just can't help myself. Like this one - I wasn't going to respond at all because I was certain the OP didn't give a #$%@ about what I thought on his misguided decision, but then I got suckered in to adding a smart-assed comment on the value of Duct Tape, and it just grew from there.

 

Anyway, since you requested it, I'll try and cover the basic points, and if you want more you'll just have to search for older threads (look for "induction", "afterfire", "after fire" or "popping", but not "AIS" - 3 letters are too short for the search engine). Or you can always call me, and I'll be happy to talk about it.

 

First of all, even though most folks use the term backfire, that is not what is happening. A backfire is an explosion back through the carburetor. Our problem is popping or banging in the exhaust, which is properly termed an afterfire or afterburn. The ONLY reason you get an afterfire is that too much unburned fuel gets blown through into the exhaust system, then it either mixes with fresh air and spontaneously ignites, or if it is really concentrated in the header, it can be ignited by the next opening of the exhaust valve. The AIS valve actually STOPS afterfire by shutting off the air induction into the header when conditions for an afterfire are prime, such as chopping the throttle.

 

There are really only two things that can cause too much unburned fuel in the exhaust: One is killing the ignition while the bike is rolling in gear, such as briefly hitting the kill switch. That is pretty rare and is not something in which we are interested. The real cause in day-to-day running is anything that upsets the normal combustion cycle, such as an overly lean mixture or poor spark. Note that this is NOT the same as having a completely dead cylinder. To get an afterfire you have to have incomplete or poor combustion, but it must be firing enough to get the header temperatures over 600 degrees.

 

The most common problem is a vacuum leak - this could be anything at all that allows air to be sucked in between the carburetor and the intake valve, and the primary problems on our bikes are the rubber caps and vacuum hoses on the nipples used to sync the carbs. Those rubber caps only last about two years. Pull them off and bend them, looking closely for any signs of cracking. Even if the cracks do not extend all the way through, my experience shows that this is the point when the caps leak enough around the nipple during the high-vacuum points to cause the problem. The two vacuum hoses actually close the AIS valves during high vacuum, so if they are cut or nicked with pliers when taking them off for a sync (very common problem) you have a double whammy - both a vacuum leak AND an inoperative AIS valve.

 

If you do not have a vacuum leak, then check for anything that can affect a strong and steady spark. Most common is old spark plugs, but the metal parts inside the spark plug caps can corrode and affect that too. I have published info here on how to check that and clean the parts to restore them.

 

Finally, even if you do not have any vacuum leaks or spark problems, a leak in the exhaust system can defeat the purpose of the AIS valves. The most common problem on our bikes is a bad crimp at the Y joint, but it can also be caused by loose header bolts or missing bolts in the ports for an exhaust gas analyzer. Note that if there is an exhaust leak, plugging the AIS system will not stop the popping, since the air that is causing the problem is coming from the leak.

Goose

[1joeranger]

Thanks!! That made a hell of a lot of sense and I will be attuned for this in the future! Plus I don't think anyone has come up with a superior niffy way of plugging whatever remains of the AIS system! Thank you for your passion and incitefullness! I know I nipped one of the hoses the first time I did a carb sync and never thought much about it. That will be corrected tomorrow. I replaced the plugs this pass winter and have checked the resistance on the wire and believe I am good there. I averaged 40mpg to and back from Ohio and that was hauling that heavy trailer and pushing 70 on the interstates. You set my pilot screws redid my sync so I think I'll hang on to my AIS!

 

I love doing things the right way and not necessarily the popular way! I am going go back and read all the threads regarding "induction", "afterfire", "after fire" or "popping" I also love being knowledgeable!! Again Thanks!!

[Bobby G]

"Like this one - I wasn't going to respond at all because I was certain the OP didn't give a #$%@ about what I thought on his misguided decision, but then I got suckered in to adding a smart-assed comment on the value of Duct Tape, and it just grew from there."

 

Hey Goose, great recap of this whole AIS thing (again!).

 

Anyway, I apologize if I offended anyone sensibilities with my little "shortcut" in plugging the AIS using a tapered wire nut wrapped in a little bit of tape to make a snug, secure fit. But misguided? Come on, it ain't that bad of a mod on a component that is more like your appendix than your liver. (Your liver you need - - your appendix you don't, and is just God's little anatomical joke!)

 

Hope you really don't think I don't give a #$%@ (hope I spelled it right!) about your advice. I do! You are a very knowledgeable guy on the RSV.

 

Thanks!

[V7Goose]

"Like this one - I wasn't going to respond at all because I was certain the OP didn't give a #$%@ about what I thought on his misguided decision, but then I got suckered in to adding a smart-assed comment on the value of Duct Tape, and it just grew from there."

 

Hey Goose, great recap of this whole AIS thing (again!).

 

Anyway, I apologize if I offended anyone sensibilities with my little "shortcut" in plugging the AIS using a tapered wire nut wrapped in a little bit of tape to make a snug, secure fit. But misguided? Come on, it ain't that bad of a mod on a component that is more like your appendix than your liver. (Your liver you need - - your appendix you don't, and is just God's little anatomical joke!)

 

Hope you really don't think I don't give a #$%@ (hope I spelled it right!) about your advice. I do! You are a very knowledgeable guy on the RSV.

 

Thanks!

Bobby, you didn't offend anyone with your tape (or at least not me), it is just that some of us have seen such horrible things come from that cruddy tape as it breaks down we wanted to advise people to avoid it for anything but temporary needs.

 

But I DO take exception (not offense) at your comparison of the AIS system to an appendix - that is not even close. I was calling your decision to disable the AIS misguided, not how you did it. It is absolutely true that the AIS does absolutely nothing to change your bikes performance, but it does have one very important purpose and the huge accidental benefit that I described above. A functioning AIS system reduces air pollution from your engine at absolutely ZERO cost or impact to you! So if it provides a benefit at absolutely NO impact on your performance or economy, what possible value could you find in disabling it? That is like pouring a cup of pee into your pool just because you can.

 

So lets briefly re-visit the reason I assume you chose to make this misguided decision - because your bike was popping and banging on deceleration. And this is where you as the owner of that machine should have really appreciated the accidental value of the AIS; even if you don't remotely care at all about air pollution, your bike has something wrong with it, and the AIS was telling you that. But instead of caring about that problem with your bike and fixing it, you just wanted the bike to quite telling you it had a problem. THAT, my friend, is misguided in my book.

Ride safe,

Goose

[Guest tx2sturgis]

I think its time we get back to talking about duct tape again!

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duct_tape

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duct_tape_occlusion_therapy

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duct_tape_alert

 

http://www.duckbrand.com/Promotions/stuck-at-prom.aspx

 

 

It seems to have a number of uses, from plugging the AIS to making a prom dress. Biohazard blocking to wart removal.

 

Even the astronauts on Apollo 13 used it and it helped save their lives!

 

But maybe some posters on this thread will relate to this quote from "A Prairie Home Companion Radio Show":

 

"Duct tape is more than a miracle adhesive, it's a balm for the soul of the unprepared and inept."

 

(I resemble that remark!)

 

Now putting away my duct tape lightsaber.