Squeeze Posted April 28, 2012 Share #26 Posted April 28, 2012 Well, i made made my Case already, i have nothing to add. Let's agree to disagree. This works for me, works even on my '99 Max who has been tough on bleeding the Clutch and the rear Brake since i got her. I hang a five kg Weight on the Brake Pedal and after three Nights, it's going from almost no Pressure to firm Line. The Guys in the Racing Business do it every Night. I'm sorry if it doesn't work for, for whatever Reason. Even when you say it can't work, the Air Bubbles i see coming up through through the first Bore on Lever Release is enough Proof for me. You often come up with Reverse Bleeding, it might work for you, it never worked that good for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted April 28, 2012 Share #27 Posted April 28, 2012 Well, i made made my Case already, i have nothing to add. Let's agree to disagree. This works for me, works even on my '99 Max who has been tough on bleeding the Clutch and the rear Brake since i got her. I hang a five kg Weight on the Brake Pedal and after three Nights, it's going from almost no Pressure to firm Line. The Guys in the Racing Business do it every Night. I'm sorry if it doesn't work for, for whatever Reason. Even when you say it can't work, the Air Bubbles i see coming up through through the first Bore on Lever Release is enough Proof for me. You often come up with Reverse Bleeding, it might work for you, it never worked that good for me. Not much of a case, but if you say so?? Also, if you don't get good results reverse bleeding...although it's not the subject of this discussion... you're not doing it right?? And if you or your racing friends are not able to keep the air out of the lines while flushing, you're not doing that right either... Personally I'd rather go riding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yammer Dan Posted April 28, 2012 Share #28 Posted April 28, 2012 No one is saying there are not other ways to bleed. But this works when having trouble getting all the air out. One of those things that just does. There are a few things I do that I've picked up on this site and ask no questions. This is one of them that works. Don't try it if you don't want to. I will continue to use this when needed. Thanks Squeeze. Can't remember where I got this tip but I couldn't get something bled and it got me on the road!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted April 28, 2012 Share #29 Posted April 28, 2012 No one is saying there are not other ways to bleed. But this works when having trouble getting all the air out. One of those things that just does. There are a few things I do that I've picked up on this site and ask no questions. This is one of them that works. Don't try it if you don't want to. I will continue to use this when needed. Thanks Squeeze. Can't remember where I got this tip but I couldn't get something bled and it got me on the road!!! Dan, I'm not talking about bleeding the clutch, or bleeding the brakes... The point I'm trying to make is pulling lever back and holding it against the grip overnight will not let any air out of the line. When I first read about it years ago on this board I gave it a try. Full compression, and as some others suggested half way. Neither worked. I hadn't rebuilt any masters yet, but when I did I finally understood why it didn't. I don't have any first hand experience with a lot of things Venture, other than what I've learned second hand reading about it here, but one thing I do know a lot about is brakes and clutches. Leaving the clutch lever alone and letting the bike sit over night, with the reserve placed as high as you can get it, will actually have a better chance of working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05Venture Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share #30 Posted April 28, 2012 Thanks again for all the suggestions most of which I had already tried. However, I decided that today i would try bleeding the clutch again. I did this very slowly and bled the clutch several times. Almost a half of a pint I ran through the system. Afterwards, I took the bike for a short ride and the clutch felt great. The gears shifted with ease even at a stopped position which in the past was difficult. I didn't get to ride long enough to get the engine really hot which is where the shifting usually gives me more issues, but I hope to try it out soon. I will post my results once I see how it performs. Thanks again, Todd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05Venture Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share #31 Posted April 30, 2012 Well unfortuntely the problem still exist. Rode the bike on a decent ride yesterday and the same issues as before with the shifting. Not sure what to do at this time. Guess I will try a different oil on the next oil change. Thanks again for all the assistance. Todd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tx2sturgis Posted April 30, 2012 Share #32 Posted April 30, 2012 Well unfortuntely the problem still exist. Rode the bike on a decent ride yesterday and the same issues as before with the shifting. Not sure what to do at this time. Guess I will try a different oil on the next oil change. Thanks again for all the assistance. Todd Go back and read my posts again. Bleeding doesnt help, and neither does it help to service the linkage. Its an internal thing with the clutch/transmission/oil situation. I dont have the answer yet, but its NOT air in the clutch (brake) fluid and its not the linkage binding up. Its engine heat related, and its downshifting only, and it SEEMS to get worse with synthetic. Or I could be imagining ALL of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squeeze Posted April 30, 2012 Share #33 Posted April 30, 2012 ... The point I'm trying to make is pulling lever back and holding it against the grip overnight will not let any air out of the line.... Well, Jack, I completely agree with you on that Part. How could get Air out of the Line when the Seal of the Piston is beyond both, feeding and Pressure Relief Hole. The Air won't come out into the Reservoir until you release the Lever, then, when the Lever and the Piston are unblocing both Bores, the Air will come out of the Line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted April 30, 2012 Share #34 Posted April 30, 2012 Well, Jack, I completely agree with you on that Part. How could get Air out of the Line when the Seal of the Piston is beyond both, feeding and Pressure Relief Hole. The Air won't come out into the Reservoir until you release the Lever, then, when the Lever and the Piston are unblocking both Bores, the Air will come out of the Line. Hi Squeeze. The lip of the clutch master cup only retracts far enough to expose the expansion hole in the master barrel. The feed hole remains behind the lip of the cup. In the past when ever I've had air come out that hole it came out very slowly, and in little strings of micro bubbles. Now I can understand undoing the lever and letting it sit for an hour or so, but everyone that gives advice on the tied lever 'trick' never mentions this. The air just doesn't disappear magically... The first thing the person will do after releasing is pull the lever to test the clutch. A little of the air will spurt out, but a lot of it will go back down into the line. If the clutch is allowed to sit over night without the lever being pulled back, in the morning there will only be fluid in the barrel. The point I'm trying to make is the same thing would happen leaving the master sit overnight without tying the lever to the grip. Sorry to be stuburn about this, but I put the tied clutch lever in the same catagory as the Jason Mod.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinR Posted May 1, 2012 Share #35 Posted May 1, 2012 So I just did the clutch upgrade this weekend and finished off with an oil change today, then took it out for a spin. What a surprise to find formerly smooth as silk downshifting now be in need of a very firm push on the gear shift. Upshifts feel no different at all. Same brand and weight oil as I had before so nothing new there. With the clutch engaging sooner could it not be possible that the linkage might need some adjustment? BTW, the clutch upgrade is absolutely WOW! Nothing has changed at all, same temperature, same oil, but upgraded clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tx2sturgis Posted May 1, 2012 Share #36 Posted May 1, 2012 So I just did the clutch upgrade this weekend and finished off with an oil change today, then took it out for a spin. What a surprise to find formerly smooth as silk downshifting now be in need of a very firm push on the gear shift. Upshifts feel no different at all. Same brand and weight oil as I had before so nothing new there. With the clutch engaging sooner could it not be possible that the linkage might need some adjustment? BTW, the clutch upgrade is absolutely WOW! Nothing has changed at all, same temperature, same oil, but upgraded clutch. Now this is vedddyy inte-westing. Might be a clue in here somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05Venture Posted May 3, 2012 Author Share #37 Posted May 3, 2012 So I just did the clutch upgrade this weekend and finished off with an oil change today, then took it out for a spin. What a surprise to find formerly smooth as silk downshifting now be in need of a very firm push on the gear shift. Upshifts feel no different at all. Same brand and weight oil as I had before so nothing new there. With the clutch engaging sooner could it not be possible that the linkage might need some adjustment? BTW, the clutch upgrade is absolutely WOW! Nothing has changed at all, same temperature, same oil, but upgraded clutch. What clutch upgarde did you do? I am curious if it is the same as me. I added the heavy duty spring and removed one clutch disc. Just curious if this is possibly an issue with mine? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinR Posted May 7, 2012 Share #38 Posted May 7, 2012 The upgrade I did is the one with the heavier spring plus the addition of an extra full disc to replace the half disc. Skydoc_17 sells them here. The downshifting is easier now when the bike is cold but still a little tougher when hot. Neutral seems to be more difficult to engage now also but for the benefit of the upgrade I can handle the little quirks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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