dna9656 Posted July 29, 2018 Author Share #26 Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) Doug, right here on THIS site is a tutorial for rebuilding the forks with lots of good self explanatory pics: https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?496-Fork-Seal-Replacement Well; Thanks to your drawing, $12.00 and my own $12.00 per I FINALLY GOT what you have been getting at! I got a light and a poky (pointed tool) and found the three washers you're talking about! They are INSIDE the "Top Hat"! How are they replaced? They must be replaceable as they are listed separately in the parts Illustrated Parts Breakdown (IPB), Exploded Parts View (EPV) or what ever you'd like to call it... I GENTLY tried to separate the top hat from the shaft and that worked ok but what is the procedure to replace these washers? The "Top Hat" doesn't seem to want to come apart.... So since I was looking in the lower (outer) tube for washers and there weren't any and I could NOT UNDERSTAND how the washers could have "fallen out" of the lower (outer tube) as any washer in the lower (outer tube) had to be 2" or so in diameter I figured they were missing and ordered them. So, I am pretty sure I can cancel the 4 flats washers but am unsure of the 2 spring washers I got the 4 at $6.60 each and the spring for $15.?? each. Should I just get these washers and hold on to them for my own or other's (sell them) use or cancel the orders? I have also misteakenly (arg, arg, arg) ordered an extra set of sliders, metal.... I got the parts apart, they were assembled incorrectly by a PO I suppose Considering the shape these washers are in I think I'll just replace them. Edited July 29, 2018 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 29, 2018 Author Share #27 Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) 26H-2319L-00-00 is the part number for the FLAT washer; 26H-2319M-00-00 is the part number for the WAVE washer! I hope you just mistyped. https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113843 You said that the seat plate would not come off the damping rod. Since the oil lock was installed upside down, I wonder if the three washers have fallen down inside the oil lock where you can't see them. I also wonder, because the oil lock was installed upside down, that the small end of the oil lock has been rammed into the seat plate (top hat), effectively wedging the two together. https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113844 I got the Oil lock (Top Hat) off and found the 3 washers inside not wedging the 2 parts together. I take it the proper way to install the oil lock (top hat) is shown in your wonderful drawing? The "TOP HAT" or Oil Lock is 2 pieces pressed together; as mentioned above the 3 washers (are no longer) inside as I separated the 2 pieces. In the Photo they are on the right and re-joined. The so called "spring washer" is a pretty _ iss poor example of a spring washer and the other 2 washers are not flat either. 2 of the washers must be the "flat" ones as they are the same color, sort of copper in color, maybe plated... the other is defiantly different and PRETTY FLAT. Now the pictures in the tutorial don't show the steel piece that I have. The part that is pressed into the steel part with the black seal looks like the one in the instructions but the pic in the instructions has no steel seal part New info: Been out in the shop.... Like so? Edited July 29, 2018 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairiehammer Posted July 29, 2018 Share #28 Posted July 29, 2018 I got the Oil lock (Top Hat) off and found the 3 washers inside not wedging the 2 parts together. I take it the proper way to install the oil lock (top hat) is shown in your wonderful drawing? Doug, Doug, Doug. The Oil Lock is the aluminum thing. The seat plate, "top hat" is the steel and rubbery seal thing. And NO, my drawing reflects how your set up is NOW, NOT HOW IT IS SUPPOSED TO GO BACK TOGETHER! The correct way is: damping rod> wave washer>flat washer>wave washer>oil lock (FLANGE DOWN)>seat plate (seal UP). Just like this photo, with the addition of the seat plate: Did you not read the tech article on VRO, that I linked too? The ONLY difference between how the article describes the process and your 1988 is the addition of the seat plate ("top hat") with the SEAL UP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 29, 2018 Author Share #29 Posted July 29, 2018 Doug, Doug, Doug. The Oil Lock is the aluminum thing. https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113845 The seat plate, "top hat" is the steel and rubbery seal thing. https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113846 And NO, my drawing reflects how your set up is NOW, NOT HOW IT IS SUPPOSED TO GO BACK TOGETHER! The correct way is: damping rod> wave washer>flat washer>wave washer>oil lock (FLANGE DOWN)>seat plate (seal UP). Just like this photo, with the addition of the seat plate: https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113847 Did you not read the tech article on VRO, that I linked too? The ONLY difference between how the article describes the process and your 1988 is the addition of the seat plate ("top hat") with the SEAL UP! The tech article didn't show the steel things with the seal.... so I needed to know how the seal thingy was installed. I hope my prev. corrected post is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 30, 2018 Author Share #30 Posted July 30, 2018 (edited) I removed the "piston" on each side of the fork and installed the 2 seals above and the slider, metal. I have new copper washers to use on the 10mm Allen bolt when I put the outer lower back on. Right now I'm waiting on new pistons. It out to be a pretty nice fork when I'm done. I sure appreciate y'alls help, patience, and understanding! And what about that drawing! WOWZERS! Thank you Prarrie Hammer! Edited July 30, 2018 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairiehammer Posted July 30, 2018 Share #31 Posted July 30, 2018 (edited) New info: Been out in the shop.... Like so? https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113849 NO! Not like that! The seat plate must be flipped around, so the seal is UP!, not down like you have pictured. Concerning the drawing I made of the damping rod with oil lock and seat plate; there may have been some confusion about that drawing and the orientation of the various components depicted. To be clear: the drawing reflects the IMPROPER orientation of the oil lock AS FOUND, not as it should be. I have edited the drawing to add disclaimer and clarification. The correct assembly is depicted in this drawing: Edited July 30, 2018 by Prairiehammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 31, 2018 Author Share #32 Posted July 31, 2018 no! Not like that! The seat plate must be flipped around, so the seal is up!, not down like you have pictured. Concerning the drawing i made of the damping rod with oil lock and seat plate; there may have been some confusion about that drawing and the orientation of the various components depicted. To be clear: The drawing reflects the improper orientation of the oil lock as found, not as it should be. https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113853i have edited the drawing to add disclaimer and clarification. The correct assembly is depicted in this drawing: https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=113854 ok, got it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 31, 2018 Author Share #33 Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) Well apparently there are no free video hosting sits besides youtube and they said they would get back with me in 3 to 5 days about my pass word. That's a big help. Any one know of a free video hosting site? Edited July 31, 2018 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted July 31, 2018 Author Share #34 Posted July 31, 2018 Hey Doug, Where to begin! The "Spring Washer" that you are assuming is a wavy washer is in fact a tube with a washer on each end. The "tube" preloads the fork springs, and this is why your current springs are so much shorter than the new Progressive springs. The lower set of bushings are usually good, and don't need to be replaced...usually. ID mic of both the top and bottom bushings will tell the story. The top bushings are the ones that get sloppy. Unfortunately, they are no longer offered from Yamaha for either the MKI or MKII motorcycles. The upper bushings are made from a free machining mild steel called Leadloy. I have had good luck machining them from bushing bronze as well. The bushing bronze makes for a smoother fork action, but doesn't last nearly as long as the mild steel. In your PM, you asked about electroplating the existing worn out bushings, The issue with this would be the upper fork tubes are hard chrome plated. Usually with a bushing/slide mechanism, one surface is hard, (hardly wears at all) and the other surface is sacrificial. (wears the most) With the hard chromed upper fork tubes being hard, and the electroplated inner bushing surfaces being hard as well, you would most likely wear out the upper fork tube in the area where the fork seal rides, causing a leak, and requiring the upper fork tubes to be replaced. That's why the sacrificial surface is usually the cheaper of the two parts. It's just a shame that Yamaha no longer makes these parts for our bikes. To make these bushings, machine a ring OD to the size of the bore in the lower fork tube. (Which requires the measurement of that bore to .0001", to get a "push fit") Then machine the ID of the bushing to the OD of the upper fork tube +.002". (Which would require the measurement of the OD of the upper fork tube as well) Then take a hacksaw and split the ring in two. You also asked about the PVC shim that comes with the Progressive springs. I weigh 185 lbs. and used half of the provided shim in each tube. Other factors are the weight of the fork oil, if you weigh more or less, are riding two up, etc. Like I said earlier, you will be lucky if you get it right the first time. But to answer your question, you will need some shim to preload the springs, or your front end will be too bouncy. Earl So can you give me the P/N of the upper bushing Yamaha no longer offers? I got the pistons and the slide and I got the little ^%$#*&^& washers. Do you mean that aluminum piece just below the "Piston"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted August 2, 2018 Author Share #35 Posted August 2, 2018 ok, got it!!! Waiting for those little, tiny washers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted August 2, 2018 Author Share #36 Posted August 2, 2018 (edited) All; So, now that it's put together correctly (with Prairie Hammer's & Skydoc's help and input) I have another question; With the Inner (upper) tube still installed in the triple tree when sliding the tube, outer 1 (& 2) up the assemble how is the seat plate, spindle, and washers kept in place when sliding down the lower tube? I received the "pistons" (wide bushing on the bottom today and installed them. See pics from earlier posts. The ones found on the bike spun freely in the installed location, the new ones with turn by hand with a bit of resistance, lots tighter than the ones i removed so I guess it was a good thing to replace as well. Edited August 2, 2018 by dna9656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairiehammer Posted August 2, 2018 Share #37 Posted August 2, 2018 With the Inner (upper) tube still installed in the triple tree when sliding the tube, outer 1 (& 2) up the assemble how is the seat plate, spindle, and washers kept in place when sliding down the lower tube? A bit of Vaseline on all the pieces should hold them together enough to reassemble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna9656 Posted August 3, 2018 Author Share #38 Posted August 3, 2018 A bit of Vaseline on all the pieces should hold them together enough to reassemble. Sounds like a sticky situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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