Trader Posted March 19, 2016 Share #1 Posted March 19, 2016 (edited) OK....so I changed the shift segment under the clutch basket on my 88 with a solid one piece shift segment as is used in a 2nd gen. 1: I had to remove the shifter lever linkage from the inner shift shaft (left side of bike) and remove the shift linkage so it was out of the way to get the old shift segment off. But that was all reinstalled properly and it's out of the way of the clutch basket anyway. 1: I made sure that when I installed the outer clutch basket it seated properly. 2: I installed the outer clutch basket 3:I installed the thrust washer that fits the splines on top of the outer basket. It actually slips beyond the splines but I remember it was like that when I took it out because I had to align the spines to get that washer off. 4: I installed the locking tab and torqued the large nut to 50 ft/lbs From the bottom of the basket..... 1: a narrow black steel band which I know belongs there because I never removed it. 2: a half size spring plate marked "this side out: 3: half friction disk 5: steel disk 5: retaining wire 6: friction disk/steel/friction/steel etc until the last one on the top of the stack was the friction disk with the odd shaped cut out. I made sure that the 2 notch disks were all aligned with the 2 dots on the basket. 6: put the center plug on the shaft 7: put the clutch boss in place, making sure it was bottomed and sitting on that center plug. 8: Made sure the small spring retainer was sitting in the surface of the spring boss with the rim facing up to hold the spring properly 9:installed the small pressure plate with 6 bolts, 10: tightened the 6 bolts alternating opposite sides and as per Skydoc's suggestion of using reasonable pressure with the ratchet in my palm and using only my wrist to tighten. (I don't have a torque wrench suitable) I did not pull the clutch handle when it was apart t and I did not do anything with the pins from the clutch slave....although admittedly I don't remember even seeing anything. It there any chance those pins could have dropped out? OTHERWISE, WHAT DID I DO WRONG??? I can't pull the clutch in at all! Edited March 19, 2016 by Trader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted March 19, 2016 Share #2 Posted March 19, 2016 You put the washer in the wrong spot. Don't ask me exactly where or how, check the diagrams in the book, I just remember doing it wrong. It doesn't go in logical sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eck Posted March 20, 2016 Share #3 Posted March 20, 2016 Squeeze clutch lever and loosen clutch bleeder at same time, then tighten the bleeder BEFORE you let off the clutch lever... Do this only once and then see if it works correctly.. Mine did same thing and this is all I had to do.... Bleed it ONCE...but make darn sure you tighten the bleeder before you let off the clutch lever.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 20, 2016 Author Share #4 Posted March 20, 2016 Thanks Eck.....I'm pretty sure it's all put together properly so I'll try your suggestion tomorrow afternoon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eck Posted March 20, 2016 Share #5 Posted March 20, 2016 Thanks Eck.....I'm pretty sure it's all put together properly so I'll try your suggestion tomorrow afternoon! @Trader, Let me know if that was it please. I like to keep notes on possible fix's that work for certain problems. Thanks Eck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted March 20, 2016 Share #6 Posted March 20, 2016 You put the washer in the wrong spot. Don't ask me exactly where or how, check the diagrams in the book, I just remember doing it wrong. It doesn't go in logical sense. Me Too..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkuhr Posted March 20, 2016 Share #7 Posted March 20, 2016 You put the washer in the wrong spot. Don't ask me exactly where or how, check the diagrams in the book, I just remember doing it wrong. It doesn't go in logical sense. Me 3. Here is to post Rocket corrected me on: Did you put the splined washer between the inner hub & outer basket upon re-assembly, or under the nut??? If under the nut, you need to pull the clutch again & put it between the hub and basket. I have seen this error, lock up the clutch before, regardless of master / slave cylinder action. :bang head: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 22, 2016 Author Share #8 Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) No Joy! I released the clutch bleeder twice...still locked up. For sure the splined washer is above the outer basket and under the inner basket I took the spring and clutch boss off, and all the plates down to the wire. Then I thought before I pull it apart, to try to pull the clutch a little to see if the center piece moved. that is the part that pushes the clutch apart right? The clutch master pushes on the pin which pushes on the plunger with the oil ring in the center of the clutch boss. That plunger didn't budge so I'm going to tear it all apart again and try it again. Edited March 22, 2016 by Trader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 22, 2016 Author Share #9 Posted March 22, 2016 OK...so both baskets are out and the clutch is still jammed up. NO REASON!!! I haven't touched the clutch master or resevoir and only touched the slave to bleed it 2 squeezes worth from your suggestions. On the other side, the push pin and ball bearing are in place and in the proper order/alignment There is pressure to the slave cyl. because there is a strong stream when I pull the clutch lever and open the bleeder so I haven't kinked the clutch or crushed the fluid line. Could the slave go bad just sitting over the winter??? seems pretty unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowpuc Posted March 22, 2016 Share #10 Posted March 22, 2016 May sound nuts but I would double check the little bleed back return hole in the master cylinder to make sure that the clutch fluid is able to return into the res. Its that little tiny hair sized hole... Hmmmm,,, having released the pressure at the slave that probably isnt the issue.... Sure starting to sound like a stuck slave to me too Trader.... While is does not seem likely that a slave would stick like that from sitting there have been stranger things that have happened so I suppose its possible... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted March 23, 2016 Share #11 Posted March 23, 2016 Did you happen to pull the clutch handle when you had the basket apart, if you did, then maybe you pushed the piston out too far and now is stuck. I would think that the slave would leak in such a case though. To check this out you might check the unloaded position of the push rod. I think it needs to be flush with the boss, or nearly so, so if it's sticking out so that you could grab it with a pair of pliers then that might be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paysaw Posted March 23, 2016 Share #12 Posted March 23, 2016 I am in the middle of a rebuild and having the same problem. I am pulling my slave.I think my slave is stuck.Trader we should chat too.LOL Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted March 23, 2016 Share #13 Posted March 23, 2016 With the engine off, put the bike in gear. Can you move the bike? If you can move the bike in gear then the piston was likely over extended and got stuck there holding the clutch in a disengaged position. I do not know if you could push the piston back from the other side of the bike to free it up. If you can not move the bike, then it is most likely a seized piston in the slave. Maybe pull harder on the clutch lever to brake it loose or try getting it to move from the other side of the engine. But even if you do get it to move, if it got stuck once then it is likely there is/was moisture in the system that has caused corrosion to stick the piston and you may still end up rebuilding or replacing the slave. But from your descriptions, since you are certain that everything is assembled correctly and you do have fluid movement to the slave, the only thing left is the slave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted March 23, 2016 Share #14 Posted March 23, 2016 The best way to check the hydraulic side of the clutch system is to pull the pressure plate and lightly pull the lever with you finger over the rod tip. If it moves then it's mechanical. If it doesn't then it's hydraulic.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share #15 Posted March 23, 2016 The bike is torn apart and up on the lift. I have not pulled the clutch lever while disassembled, but I have bumped my head a couple of times on the bars. (my garage is pretty tight quarters!) Which makes me think MAYBE It was the lever I hit and did pressureize the system and move the rod. Next time I'm out there I'll try to push back on the rod while cracking the bleeder and see if it moves in at all. I'll keep you posted. Totally unrelated question..can you use brake cleaner as a general degreaser/cleaner? It works great but I don't know if it eats rubber or anything else. The engine degreaser just leaves a sudsy mess! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share #16 Posted March 23, 2016 OK...still no joy. I tried releasing pressure while pushing back in on the rod....but no movement at all. I guess the next step is removing the slave! I just replaced it new 2-3 years ago! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted April 3, 2016 Author Share #17 Posted April 3, 2016 Just to close this thread... It turned out that the push rod was extending on its own so when I cracked the bleeder and pushed the rod back in...by the time I got the clutch back in, the rod was extended again and the clutch was frozen. It seems simple but took awhile to figure out. We put the clutch together AGAIN but this time we loosened the bleeder while we tightened the spring. Then once the clutch was in, we had to bleed it and everything was good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted April 3, 2016 Share #18 Posted April 3, 2016 That just doesn't make any sense. When the master is released then the slave should be able to be pushed back, if it won't then there is a problem with the master. Maybe a good cleaning is in order before you get some problems with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted April 3, 2016 Share #19 Posted April 3, 2016 That just doesn't make any sense. When the master is released then the slave should be able to be pushed back, if it won't then there is a problem with the master. Maybe a good cleaning is in order before you get some problems with it. I'm with Carl on this one. Simple question. Did you remove the rods and ball when working on the clutch?? If you did they could be binding because they weren't put back in correctly.... Also the spring in the slave will keep enough pressure on the rods to keep them against the throw out bearing in the pressure plate and keep them snug. The hydraulic fluid is static until the lever is applied and has nothing to do with loose rods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share #20 Posted May 24, 2016 Sorry guys...I didn't see your responses. I don't know why it worked...all I know is that it did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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