Dmnordin Posted September 8, 2012 Share #1 Posted September 8, 2012 This morning I was in the middle of replacing my clutch bearing on my 86 engine in my 83 Venture. I took the entire clutch basket out, which is a very good thing. On the very back of the clutch basket there is a gear, it drives a plastic gear on a keyed shaft going through the case. a screw had broken that holds the retaining piece for the shaft, so it was floating. On the other side of the case, where there is a gear on the other end of the shaft, that gear meshes with a plastic gear that drives the oil pump. that plastic gear was stripped. So my engines been running without oil supply probably for 150 miles this week. crap, crap, crap. I need an engine, a different bike, a new bike, ...no money. crap, crap, crap. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonRider Posted September 8, 2012 Share #2 Posted September 8, 2012 Did your engine quit running, if not and you want I have an 86 in pieces in my shop, I wont be using them so they are yours for a decent price plus shipping. I can take pictures of the parts you need if you like to see them. This morning I was in the middle of replacing my clutch bearing on my 86 engine in my 83 Venture. I took the entire clutch basket out, which is a very good thing. On the very back of the clutch basket there is a gear, it drives a plastic gear on a keyed shaft going through the case. a screw had broken that holds the retaining piece for the shaft, so it was floating. On the other side of the case, where there is a gear on the other end of the shaft, that gear meshes with a plastic gear that drives the oil pump. that plastic gear was stripped. So my engines been running without oil supply probably for 150 miles this week. crap, crap, crap. I need an engine, a different bike, a new bike, ...no money. crap, crap, crap. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmnordin Posted September 8, 2012 Author Share #3 Posted September 8, 2012 the 86 engine didn't quit running. Last weekend I headed out for a 4 day trip to Western Colorado. Saturday, I rode out to Vernal, Utah, met up with a couple of people, and we rode around Flaming Gorge. 400 mile day for me. on a couple of the switchbacks on the way back to vernal, I had some funky noise after downshifting. I suspect that was the plastic gear being stripped. I was getting what sounded and acted like the clutch bearing complaining after the ride. We transported my bike back home on Sunday in my friend's truck, and I commuted 150 miles to and from work Wed thru Fri since my bike is my main transportation mode. so, your 86 engine is all apart? Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonRider Posted September 8, 2012 Share #4 Posted September 8, 2012 Its not completely apart, I split the cases and removed the tranny and swapped it into my 83 since it was shot. As far as I know it was a running engine. Oil pump is out, in fact it is still sitting on my work bench. What parts do you need, I am sure it wont take much to pull them out if they are still in the engine, I know the gears on the pump are good, I had the oil pump out to pull the tranny. the 86 engine didn't quit running. Last weekend I headed out for a 4 day trip to Western Colorado. Saturday, I rode out to Vernal, Utah, met up with a couple of people, and we rode around Flaming Gorge. 400 mile day for me. on a couple of the switchbacks on the way back to vernal, I had some funky noise after downshifting. I suspect that was the plastic gear being stripped. I was getting what sounded and acted like the clutch bearing complaining after the ride. We transported my bike back home on Sunday in my friend's truck, and I commuted 150 miles to and from work Wed thru Fri since my bike is my main transportation mode. so, your 86 engine is all apart? Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yamtom Posted September 8, 2012 Share #5 Posted September 8, 2012 HI, How many miles are on your engine anyways, would be nice if the rest of us could predict when this might happen to ours. Maybe change those parts to prevent it. I actually have my doubts though, that an engine would go a hundred fifty miles without oil. It seems highly likely that there would have been a seizure. I remember a buddy of mine, when we were teens, drain the oil out of a six cyl chebby, and start it up to see how far it would go, I think it was about seven minutes is all. QUOTE=Dmnordin;714150]This morning I was in the middle of replacing my clutch bearing on my 86 engine in my 83 Venture. I took the entire clutch basket out, which is a very good thing. On the very back of the clutch basket there is a gear, it drives a plastic gear on a keyed shaft going through the case. a screw had broken that holds the retaining piece for the shaft, so it was floating. On the other side of the case, where there is a gear on the other end of the shaft, that gear meshes with a plastic gear that drives the oil pump. that plastic gear was stripped. So my engines been running without oil supply probably for 150 miles this week. crap, crap, crap. I need an engine, a different bike, a new bike, ...no money. crap, crap, crap. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utadventure Posted September 8, 2012 Share #6 Posted September 8, 2012 Sorry to here it went south on you. Sounds like you have an ootion to get it back together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfoster Posted September 8, 2012 Share #7 Posted September 8, 2012 What was the snake oil they had info commercials on where they drained the oil and then drove around town to show how far it could go without quitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankd Posted September 9, 2012 Share #8 Posted September 9, 2012 What was the snake oil they had info commercials on where they drained the oil and then drove around town to show how far it could go without quitting. I think that was Arco Graphite. Arco used to be a gas station chain. They drained the oil and drove in New York city, and I think it was in a taxi. Frank d. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted September 9, 2012 Share #9 Posted September 9, 2012 I think I would do a compression check and pull a valve cover to have a look at the cams and IF both look good, replace the bad parts and run it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmnordin Posted September 9, 2012 Author Share #10 Posted September 9, 2012 I spoke with Paul DeGrey today. He pointed out that if there were no oil pressure, the dash would have shown it. So there must have been oil flowing. However, after seeing the gear condition, there's no way I would risk it totally failing while riding. I was told that the engine had about 200k miles on it a couple of years ago when I put it into the bike. I don't have any interest in cracking the case of one of these engines ; the prospect of swapping engines again is bad enough. If I hadn't done all of the things I've done to this bike, I think I would just try to move on to another bike. Right now all of that is moot, since I don't have any money. In the end, I'll most likely try to find another 86-92 engine with low miles, figure out some way to buy it, and swap engines. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friesman Posted September 9, 2012 Share #11 Posted September 9, 2012 I spoke with Paul DeGrey today. He pointed out that if there were no oil pressure, the dash would have shown it. So there must have been oil flowing. However, after seeing the gear condition, there's no way I would risk it totally failing while riding. I was told that the engine had about 200k miles on it a couple of years ago when I put it into the bike. I don't have any interest in cracking the case of one of these engines ; the prospect of swapping engines again is bad enough. If I hadn't done all of the things I've done to this bike, I think I would just try to move on to another bike. Right now all of that is moot, since I don't have any money. In the end, I'll most likely try to find another 86-92 engine with low miles, figure out some way to buy it, and swap engines. Doug HMM i am wondering how the dash would show it. As I understand the dash on my 85, the oil indicator is level only, thats why it comes on when I accelerate hard. Your heat indicator should have start to go way up if you were running with no oil pressure for any time, but I cant think of an oil pressure indicator. (But Now I gotta go check a manual...to check if what I am thinkig is right.) Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIC Posted September 9, 2012 Share #12 Posted September 9, 2012 Maybe talk to Golf and Venture (Brian) he has that 91 motor with low miles in the bike he is parting out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamamike Posted September 9, 2012 Share #13 Posted September 9, 2012 You don't really know how long you were running like that. May have just happened...I agree with others here...you may have very little damage. Check her out before you give up on her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrenchrob Posted September 9, 2012 Share #14 Posted September 9, 2012 This morning I was in the middle of replacing my clutch bearing on my 86 engine in my 83 Venture. I took the entire clutch basket out, which is a very good thing. On the very back of the clutch basket there is a gear, it drives a plastic gear on a keyed shaft going through the case. a screw had broken that holds the retaining piece for the shaft, so it was floating. On the other side of the case, where there is a gear on the other end of the shaft, that gear meshes with a plastic gear that drives the oil pump. that plastic gear was stripped. So my engines been running without oil supply probably for 150 miles this week. crap, crap, crap. I need an engine, a different bike, a new bike, ...no money. crap, crap, crap. Doug Will an engine from a second gen fit? I have one from a 2003 with about 60k on it that i woild sell for a reasonable price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dacheedah Posted September 9, 2012 Share #15 Posted September 9, 2012 It must have gotten some oil or it would have locked up on you and if all the dash lights worked something would have screamed. I agree with FF, do a compression check and see what your numbers are. I wonder if there was enough friction to turn it to deliver some oil, better lucky than good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankd Posted September 9, 2012 Share #16 Posted September 9, 2012 There is no low oil pressure warning on a Venture, only oil level. That being said, there is no way it'd run 150 miles without oil pressure and not lock up. As soon as you lost all oil pressure, it would start making knocking noises, and they'd get worse and worse until you threw a rod or it locked up. The only way you will be able to tell for certain if you had no oil pressure would be to drop the pan and pull a rod bearing cap and inspect the bearing. If you can replace the damaged oil pump drive gears without pulling the motor, I suppose you could fix that, then run the engine and see how it sounds. Then drain the oil through a rag and see if there are bearing particles in the oil. Also inspect the oil filter element. 200,000 miles isn't end of these engines.....there used to be one on a different web site that had 340,000 miles on it before it got totaled by a lady hitting it in a parking lot. However, if you do have to do that fun job of pulling the motor again, by all means find a lower mileage 1300. Frank D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted September 9, 2012 Share #17 Posted September 9, 2012 Can the oil pan be pulled with the engine in the bike? If it can then do as recommended and pull the pan, pull a bearing cap to check for galling, pull a valve cover to check the cam, do a compression check. If you can do these things with the engine in the bike and repair the pump drive in the bike, then you do not have the hassle of an engine swap and will have minimal cost involved. Does anyone know if that pump drive can be repaired without pulling the engine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rstacy Posted September 12, 2012 Share #18 Posted September 12, 2012 So now that I know that I don't have an oil pressure switch, has anyone successfully added either an idiot light or a gauge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebrrg3rd Posted September 12, 2012 Share #19 Posted September 12, 2012 Can the oil pan be pulled with the engine in the bike? If it can then do as recommended and pull the pan, pull a bearing cap to check for galling, pull a valve cover to check the cam, do a compression check. If you can do these things with the engine in the bike and repair the pump drive in the bike, then you do not have the hassle of an engine swap and will have minimal cost involved. Does anyone know if that pump drive can be repaired without pulling the engine? Jeff, the lower case is the bearing "cap". Can't see the bearings w/o splitting the case, can't split w/o removing engine. Just an FYI. As for the gears, the exposed plastic one can be changed. The one on the inside (metal) you probably need to split the case, but it's probably ok. Below is a pic of the gears with the oil pan removed. You can swap oil pumps thru the oil pan. -Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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