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Thread: 87 Royale Carbs

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    Default 87 Royale Carbs

    First things first, history, the Bike then Mine. So we can all start lobbing Bombs on the same page.
    This is my 4th Yamaha, 2nd Venture Royale. The 83 I had I bought it at 17lk miles as a basket case of parts from a dealership of all places, literally a pickup truck full of parts. 2 months later Im all over the place riding short long didnt matter. I had my own shop. My XS11 special was the first shaft drive daily driver bike to wing class Champion and Grand Champion at Norwalk 84 or 85 , been a minute. This current bike sat for years as the owners health was bad. He was a well known Guy that had a dealership in New Hampshire. His Wife was a wonderful Lady we had prayer the day I picked up the bike. Her Husband the owner of the dealership and This Bike had recently passed away. The Bike was and Is Special. considering it was missing nothing and beautiful in appearance, the price was to low to put here but for what ever reason It sat there until I made the 6 hr drive to go get it.
    It had been ridden once a year for 10 years. according to the wife it didnt get 50 miles a year Parades only.
    So Now I have it and the carbs dont wanna cooperate. without going into details, My health and living conditions went from the best of times and facilities to zero. No Home, No Shop, No Garage. So what ever I do has to be done when its not raining or snowing.
    Sunday Evening I gave her a full can of seafoam. For all you guys that are on the fence about the Foam, Its the best product of its kind on the market. If it dont work, FIX The Problem!
    This evening after climbing down off my cabin building site, I got her fired up and baby walked the rpm down as it warmed up for about 30 mins. it seemed to idle a tad better but based on throttle position and the idle screw position, its not measurable other than its not shutting off when I leave it alone, Holds steady at around 1150 rmps. any lower and she hiccups and stalls out.
    Other issues in play, the 2in x 4 inch chrome and black rectangular cover on the side of the right hand rear cylinder has a slow but steady coolant drip, Head Gasket?? Haven't run a pressure test yet. Wiring Harness connections had the green death all over the place when I first got it, nothing electrical worked except headlight and parking lights, no turn signals brake light nothing. Fuse panel and most connections full of green corrosion. Picked up a wiring harness off ebay for $35. that did the trick. I got everything working except the cruise control.
    I have another spare Harness, New Radiator. She needs some plastics repairs, I tend to use fiberglass for those as it lasts and holds better even if it is a pain to work with.
    So heres what Im thinking to do, and feel free to drop bricks on my head to stop me if im going in the wrong direction.
    1, Compression Test, Dry and wet check rings and then another go to check valve sealing.
    2. Coolant system pressure leak down test.
    3. Rebuild the carbs, at the very least diaphragms and clean the jets ( recommendations plz jet sizing?).
    4. Where the radio goes, is an empty Box No clue what was there, harness ends misc wires. Thinking it was same as my 83 stereo and intercom??
    5. Finish the rewire on the factory cruise control.
    6. Does this bike have an automated ride control system? If it does I cant find it. Its all the way down like riding a 900lb brick with a bad attitude.
    IN closing , the bike came with a $400 in parts, exhaust seals, wheel Bearings, Filters, misc nuts bolts etc.
    AND! 2 Manuals. Yamaha Factory Service Manual P/N LIT-11616-07-27 supplement and the Original P/N LIT-11616-10-67.
    If theres another Manual I need Link me up and I get to it.
    Im all Ears Gentlemen. Go easy, My Feet dont work well anymore an Im too crippled to run away from ya.
    God Bless ya and Ride Safe!!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    i FORGOT to add the name of the dealership.
    St Hilaire Motor Sport in Barrington NH.
    Im Sorry I cannot remember the gentleman's Name that was the Owner who passed away..
    If His wife is representative of who he was, then he had to be one heck of a nice Guy!!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    I'm not a great fan of Seafoam, although it works well for maintenance and is non-invasive so to speak. But reading through your wiring description, I would take the high tension wire of the ignition and make sure those are all clean and ready to work. It's a bit of a pain to get them out, but can be done. Remove the front ones first and then while they are out do the back ones, all working from the front of the bike. Cut the wires to refresh them, clean the towers of the coils, clean the coil primary contacts, and cut a bit off of the lower wire to refresh them, also take the spark plugs ends apart and clean the resistors in there, or just replace them.
    Do it now, before you forget again.
    Register today
    Rally @ T h e S h o r e s
    July 16-19th 2020



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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    A couple things I'd consider:
    First remember seafoam in the tank, in a bike that hasn't run, with some unknowns; is a slower burn, when it comes to cold ignition..

    1150 rpm then stalls: from here it sounds like she is firing on 2 jugs only.

    I am a believer in the spark gap testing before playing in the carbs; it simply helps me put together a better overall plan! You can use a grounded screwdriver if you haven't the tool..

    Compression on a long time parked engine will not be all inclusive yet is sound practice.
    I very rarely do a wet test anymore!!
    We have a thread which gives some of my old projects tricks, even if the test shows low do not give up or lift the heads until you at least try the ( a case for fogging ) tricks..
    Expect of course some rust on face and seats, but remember they rotate at rpm so with some luck they will once again seal after the heavy lifting is completed

    We'll stay tuned in to the project and input as wanted, if you suspend the project then please let us know.
    Last edited by Patch; 05-19-2020 at 02:47 PM.

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcarl View Post
    I'm not a great fan of Seafoam, although it works well for maintenance and is non-invasive so to speak. But reading through your wiring description, I would take the high tension wire of the ignition and make sure those are all clean and ready to work. It's a bit of a pain to get them out, but can be done. Remove the front ones first and then while they are out do the back ones, all working from the front of the bike. Cut the wires to refresh them, clean the towers of the coils, clean the coil primary contacts, and cut a bit off of the lower wire to refresh them, also take the spark plugs ends apart and clean the resistors in there, or just replace them.
    Added to the List and thanks a Ton!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Patch View Post
    A couple things I'd consider:
    First remember seafoam in the tank, in a bike that hasn't run, with some unknowns; is a slower burn, when it comes to cold ignition..

    1150 rpm then stalls: from here it sounds like she is firing on 2 jugs only.

    I am a believer in the spark gap testing before playing in the carbs; it simply helps me put together a better overall plan! You can use a grounded screwdriver if you haven't the tool..

    Compression on a long time parked engine will not be all inclusive yet is sound practice.
    I very rarely do a wet test anymore!!
    We have a thread which gives some of my old projects tricks, even if the test shows low do not give up or lift the heads until you at least try the ( a case for fogging ) tricks..
    Expect of course some rust on face and seats, but remember they rotate at rpm so with some luck they will once again seal after the heavy lifting is completed

    We'll stay tuned in to the project and input as wanted, if you suspend the project then please let us know.
    Last year when I brought it home, plugs gaps was the first thing done along with a very expensive oil change, I think I might have put 200 miles on it caps after initially getting her going. getting sick last fall hurt more than my head as the bike ended up uncovered and unprepped for the winter as I lay in ICU with my head cut open.
    Going to Houlton Payday, new set of plugs plug caps etc. along with some piano wire and a new torch head cleaner also good for jets and the like.
    The new list is thanks to the input received and I hope it grows as its 60 miles to the nearest parts of any kind and being a recent lobotomy [atient dont help the memory.
    Update. Bike started and ran at around 1300 rpm without the choke on . i let it run about 20 minutes. throttle cable might need replacing , does not reset after twist is bike isnt running, checked adjuster screws at the grip, NO JOY.. she starts better and didnt hiccup. How Weird.....
    Onward the List!!!
    Many Thanks Brethren!!! Inded!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    "Last year when I brought it home, plugs gaps was the first thing done"

    Not what we are referring to..
    Start here: page 7-35

    Can you give us a list of the tools you have available to use??


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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    After removing some plastic so I can see things better, ive added a new air filter to the list. also Must importantly, its NOT a Royale, just a plain Venture,.
    sitting on the bike, left front cylinder #1 ? the slider isnt moving however it is firing. all the pipes seem to be opf the same temp but I fear this bike wasnt very well treated in the long haul, too many small things not properly maintained missing or broken and taped up etc, Carb kits came today, so im going to start breaking things down..
    Seriously APPRECIATE ALL THE POINTERS TO GET ME HEADED IN THE RIGHT DIRECTIONS ON MY LIST.!!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Patch View Post
    "Last year when I brought it home, plugs gaps was the first thing done"

    Not what we are referring to..
    Start here: page 7-35

    Can you give us a list of the tools you have available to use??

    fULL SET OF SOCKETS AND WRENCHES CROWS FEET SHALLOW AND DEEP SOCKETS, 1/4 3/8 AND 1/2 IN DRIVE STUFF, IMPACTS FEELER GUAGES. OOPS SORRY FOR CAPS ..Vacum guage kit is in storage so ordered a new set. comp[ression check guages, 1/2 in and 3/8 torque wrench set both ft and inch lbs.. dont think I have any carb tools persay float guages etc. dont have any yamaha specific tools anymore unless they are in my master cabinets at the storage rooms in Ga x2. 1 for tools one for household junk,,.. full compliment of electrical testing gear. I build search and rescue copters of the large type so el;ectronics testing is covered. Piston ring compression tools ring groove cleaners, plasti guage ( old school) anfd clearance clay for checking valve clearance on flycut pistons.. thats about all I got here . Mig welding and tig machine cutting torch..
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Patch View Post
    "Last year when I brought it home, plugs gaps was the first thing done"

    Not what we are referring to..
    Start here: page 7-35

    Can you give us a list of the tools you have available to use??

    Ok I know Im missing something as I havent yet figured out where pages 7 - 35 are point me there and Im on it!!
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    At the back of the manual you will find ELEC chapter 7, the chapter has diagrams and procedures,
    at the bottom of each page you will see first the chapter # then the page #

    That said and referring to the test in question there is a simple gadget available thru most auto centers call a "spark gap tester" less then $10.00 or use a screwdriver grounded to the engine then placed in front of the cap as you spin the engine (set to run) guess at the length of ark jumping to ground...

    The easy way is to use the tester gadget I mentioned.. It quickly proves the ignition system!
    Keep in mind this this bike is setup with a wasted spark ignition when firing compression stroke it also fires one of to exhaust stroke, save on parts but, pairs the firing sequence, wins and losses just like the rest of life

    Dust off the multi meter change battery... you will likely need it

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    A couple of notes:
    The 1150 then stalls says more than the running at 1300 rpm. Either way it is to early in the game to concern over.
    Remember this is liquid cooled, after 5 minutes the jugs not firing will warm regardless due to fluid circulation, use the water spray technique on the pipes.

    As you are rebuilding the carbs:

    While off spin the engine, cover one intake pipe at a time with a flat hand, you should feel a strong pull down ONLY. If you feel any positive pressure, that is a leaking seat, remember cold seats and hot seat can behave differently,,,, but Yam seats usually seat well even cold! That would be rust then.

    When the carbs are off - are the more accurate compression result
    Measure at 5 full turns first note, then for maximum compression, 172 is the magic number.

    Note the jets # you remove, then those that you replace with. that note sheet should remain with your manual.

    Check the cable routing it should lay smooth thru it run, there is a cable run diagram in the book.

    Check vacuum tubing for cracks, check cruise control pump for leaks and clean filter.

    Logical to assume left front as #1 but it aint left rear is.
    take a couple of clear pics if you can while the carbs are off, let us have a peak for leaks and routing stuff.

    I'll say again if when you cover the intake pipes and the don't hold vacuum for 5ish seconds after you stop spinning it, let us know before you reinstalling the carbs.

    Don't skip over or rush the cleaning and jet blow through s or you will be back in there!

    Tough up your screw drivers to match the jobs, jets need to be firmly tight only or they brake, too loose and down the road chit happens!

    Wash and lube the piston slides, dry them after with a cloth, clean the bores as well, check the diagrams with a light, check both for crack and trueness of shape.

    Check floats in warm bowl of water for air bubbles.

    Set them correctly check for smooth consistent operation, then when upside down the gate is closed you should not be able to blow through the fuel inlet tube! Or you will be back in then again.

    Take your time..

    Then bench sync the plates when they are reassembled, this will be important as you do not have vacuum syncing tools. We'll walk you thru it once there

    Enjoy the sport

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  21. #13
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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Patch View Post
    A couple things I'd consider:
    First remember seafoam in the tank, in a bike that hasn't run, with some unknowns; is a slower burn, when it comes to cold ignition..

    1150 rpm then stalls: from here it sounds like she is firing on 2 jugs only.

    I am a believer in the spark gap testing before playing in the carbs; it simply helps me put together a better overall plan! You can use a grounded screwdriver if you haven't the tool..

    Compression on a long time parked engine will not be all inclusive yet is sound practice.
    I very rarely do a wet test anymore!!
    We have a thread which gives some of my old projects tricks, even if the test shows low do not give up or lift the heads until you at least try the ( a case for fogging ) tricks..
    Expect of course some rust on face and seats, but remember they rotate at rpm so with some luck they will once again seal after the heavy lifting is completed

    We'll stay tuned in to the project and input as wanted, if you suspend the project then please let us know.
    Evening Gents. Cut and trimmed all the wires changed the oil again it was horrible again but no metal shards, magnet was clean.
    She started up like all of a sudden all was good. had to back that idle screw down a lot. shut it off and went to work on the cabin. After work, I decided to take it down the road and WOW! no stalliing no hiccups. Does the XVZ1300 have an aggresive cam? This thing comes on at around 3500 and gets gone. nothing like my old venture royale I mean its stuck on stupid. Is there any way to check this aside from pulling the covers and checking lobe height??
    Thank you Gentlemen very very much. looks like the carb kits will stay in the box. its a whole nother deal now just fixing little bugs and upgrading the fuse box.
    Dont Blame me if Im in your way, Ive already been dead and tried my best to not be in your way. God has other plans so go ask him what the problem is an lemme know what he says.
    87 Venture
    03 RSV
    86 Shadow VT1100

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Did you still have the coolant leak?

    Sent from my SM-G955W using Tapatalk

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    Default Re: 87 Royale Carbs

    Good to hear.
    It is possible that he built a bit of a sleeper swapping in some V-Max parts?
    Could be heads, or cams and jetting, then likely the final drive as well.
    If the day comes you get to the carbs note the jet sizing down. The cam part number would tell you.

    So slides are working now and like suds mentioned the leak... Keep checking the connections they can be ghostly tell you get thru them all.
    When you locate the TCI note its number as well then compare it to the stock number.
    Your tank range will be reduced if those mods have been done.

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